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New Oil tank

FMA124
FMA124 Member Posts: 17
setting up a new Oil tank. Any preference from a 2 pipe install to a 1 pipe? Advantages?

Comments

  • STEVEusaPA
    STEVEusaPA Member Posts: 5,689
    1 Pipe...always. The advantages are well documented.
    But you really didn't provide much info..
    steve
  • lchmb
    lchmb Member Posts: 2,997
    1 pipe..if needed use a tigerloop..
    kcoppHVACNUT
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 11,998
    Burner pump above the lowest tank oil level ..2 pipe
    Burner pump below the lowest tank oil level ...1 pipe
  • HVACNUT
    HVACNUT Member Posts: 4,593
    Basement, buried, above outside, top fed, bottom fed gravity?
    Ah, doesn't matter.
    1 pipe with a TigerLoop Ultra.
    1/2" O.D. coated oil line sleeved through 3/4" seal tight.
    36" braided oil lines.
    (If a Riello burner, specify braided oil lines for Riello.)
    You will also need a fuel pump bypass plug if 2 pipe or TigerLoop for whichever pump is existing.
  • FMA124
    FMA124 Member Posts: 17
    Thanks everyone - the oil tank is out side and slightly above the burner 1ft higher - maybe a 20ft run... should I pipe from the top of the tank or the bottom? thoughts from the bottom is that more slug will be sucked up but not sure?
  • STEVEusaPA
    STEVEusaPA Member Posts: 5,689
    If you pipe from the top, you will have to power bleed, and make sure you have no vacuum leaks, or you will have nuisance lock outs. Also if you pipe from the top, you will have to at least once a year (fall-right before winter), drain some from the bottom to make sure you get rid of the dirt and sludge & water.
    If you pipe from the bottom, pitched toward the outlet, you get the water and sludge from the bottom, thru the filter(s).
    You shouldn't really have any sludge/water. Don't put the old oil into the new tank. And treat your tank once a year in the fall during your first fill up.
    One pipe, no tiger loop. Tiger loop is never needed on a properly installed gravity job.
    Right where the oil line enters the house I would install a fir-o-matic valve, general filter, spin on filter, oil safety valve, sleeved oil line (3/8"), and fir-o-matic at the burner.
    steve
  • New England SteamWorks
    New England SteamWorks Member Posts: 1,442
    Always pipe from the top when outside. There will always be a little water in your tank and if you pipe from the bottom it will freeze.

    = No heat.
    New England SteamWorks
    Service, Installation, & Restoration of Steam Heating Systems
    newenglandsteamworks.com
    bob17
  • vibert_c
    vibert_c Member Posts: 69
    
    Let’s discuss water in an oil storage tank!

    @New England SteamWorks
    Using a new Granby or Highland oval tank with the tank sloped
    downwards towards the horizontal ½” outlet underneath, and
    @STEVEusaPA’s method of delivery, I am curious as to how water can collect in the bottom of the tank or line, to enable freezing.

    Up until a few years ago the oil storage tanks I have been involved with had the outlet positioned on the oval end, up from the bottom of the tank about two inches. This left what we called a stub volume that contained upwards of 5.5 Imp gallons. As water is heavier than oil it would accumulate in this stub volume in the lowest portion of the bottom of the tank as it was canted to the outlet. We could not drain out this stub
    volume. When the ambient air surrounding the tank cooled sufficiently the water would freeze. On occasion when sufficient water accumulated, the burner would quit. The industry responded with a quick fix, a “conditioner/treatment” a fluid that would mix with water thence combusting in the burner. ie methanol.

    Upon the changeover from coal; delivering fuel oil through a 1" bowser hose, 100' plus long, at 25 psi took enough time, 18 minutes usually, that he would be chilled to the bone, when it was minus 25̊F. [He used to accept mum’s invitation ever delivery to a hot bowl of soup].

    As time went on the water situation deteriorated with the invention of the “fast fill” era. In their wisdom the oil dealers made four changes when fast fill was introduced.
     Increased the diameter of the bowser hose to 1 1/4"
     Increased the pressure in the hose to 85/90 psi.
     Use of a sealed cap on the filler pipe to accept a new delivery nozzle.
     Another modification was a larger vent pipe at every single tank [up from 1" to 1.25"]

    This required a rewind mechanism to recover the loaded hose to the delivery vehicle. It now was heavy enough that trained firemen used to hauling a loaded fire hose, had difficulty.

    As winter progressed the snow got over five feet deep. The delivery drivers persevered by dragging the loaded hose to the fill pipe. However, on completion of the fill, they would drop the nozzle in the snow and trudge back to the vehicle to press the button on the re-winder.

    We now have a 9" nozzle filled with snow to insert into the next
    customer’s fill pipe.

    This snow formed with the sulphur in the oil to form sulphuric acid H2SO4. In about four- seven years one could expect pin holes to form where the acid lay in the lowest point of the tank.

    All this misery caused by greedy businessmen.

    Finally Granby developed a tank with the outlet on the bottom. Wow!
    Suddenly there is no longer a stub volume, no more water collecting to freeze or form acid.

    Meantime the market was trending to gas as this was “too little, too late”.
    vibert_c








  • leonz
    leonz Member Posts: 492
    FMA124 said:

    Thanks everyone - the oil tank is out side and slightly above the burner 1ft higher - maybe a 20ft run... should I pipe from the top of the tank or the bottom? thoughts from the bottom is that more slug will be sucked up but not sure?

    ======================================================
    Use a two pipe system with a top draw and a commercial oil filter not the small blue ones. It saves dealing with a spousal unit that is not happy due to the burner air locking and or in my case the oil company not delivering oil when they were supposed to.

    Having lived with single pipe bottom draw that froze every winter we switched to a top draw single pipe and it loves to airlock when the kerosene gets low.

    I had fuel oil and they convinced me to switch to Kerosene instead of installing a two pipe system for my fuel oil which they should have done anyway.

    I will be switching to a two pipe system before too long as I have a commercial RACOR 500FG 10,000 gallon fuel filter with a water separator. I will be able to use the 50 plus gallons of kerosene sitting above the sludge in the tank rather than have the tank air lock.

    I am glad I have a new oil supplier now.
  • EBEBRATT-Ed
    EBEBRATT-Ed Member Posts: 11,998
    Any tank will collect water from condensation through the vent pipe. Any time the oil in the tank is cooler than the outdoor air water vapor will collect in the tank and condense.

    Can't stop it
  • CapeCodOilGuy
    CapeCodOilGuy Member Posts: 43
    I always draw from the top, using one pipe, a tiger loop (deaerator) and a 10-micron spin-on filter. I won't do an install or replacement without a tiger loop. In fact, I won't take on a new tune-up customer unless they'll let me put one in.
    Grallert
  • leonz
    leonz Member Posts: 492

    I always draw from the top, using one pipe, a tiger loop (deaerator) and a 10-micron spin-on filter. I won't do an install or replacement without a tiger loop. In fact, I won't take on a new tune-up customer unless they'll let me put one in.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    I was looking at installing a tigerloop with my single pipe top draw system. I phoned the tigerloop national distributor and asked about my system with its total length and elevation and the gentleman I chatted with said the tigerloop would not work properly to remove any air in the system.



  • HVACNUT
    HVACNUT Member Posts: 4,593
    What is the total length and elevation? I have an above 275 Roth tank, boiler in the basement, approximately 80 ft total run (1/2" O.D.) and a Tiger Loop Ultra. Runs at 0 vacuum.
    Others may disagree, but a Tiger Loop isn't a band-aid like like it was used for back the day when there was a suction leak on a buried tank. They're excellent for aeration and it preheats the fuel for better combustion.
    Grallert