How that steam boiler got to be so big

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How that steam boiler got to be so big

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Anthony Menafro

I ALWAYS perform a heat loss on boiler replacements. I've seen enough contractors oversize and undersize replacements. A little extra time ensures the right job providing a true service to your customers!

Solid_Fuel_Man

My challenge to all is to show (or tell) of any residential boiler that they have seen that was undersized! Radiation maybe, but boiler I bet not.

ChrisJ

Solid_Fuel_Man said:

My challenge to all is to show (or tell) of any residential boiler that they have seen that was undersized! Radiation maybe, but boiler I bet not.

When I moved into our house it had a Burnham V83 connected to 392sqft. I'm going off the top of my head, but I believe the V83 was rated for 283sqft. I think it was 68,000 btu/h output for steam.

I currently have an EG-40 rated for 325sqft connected to that same 392sqft worth of radiation.

While my current boiler is my own doing, the original one was not, so it happens but it is incredibly rare.

I can only assume who ever installed it did a heatloss on the building rather than the radiation and went by that because it's appropriate.

[Deleted User]

Yes, as a lifelong heating/boiler operator, trouble shooter type, I have come upon undersized boilers and furnaces . A lot due to a lack of knowledge on the part of jobbers. But alas some done to save some overhead on a bid job . One particular crook comes to mind who would undersize, and then over-fire ! Actually insuring a shortened life span to the unit ! Jumping out rollout switches and creating CO issues . Same exact scenario multiple times . A REALLY DANGEROUS CHARACTER ! It just comes from a lack of proper training/mentoring which, sorry to say is all too the norm these days . Living at much higher altitudes these days tho, a much more common problem is overfiring and a lack of proper de-regulation on burners, boilers, furnaces....Again, the days of truely helpful seminars and avaiable technical training given by old, experienced field techs are behind us . BUYER BEWARE AND KEEP YOUR LAWYERS NUMBER HANDY ! ! That's the modern American way !

Solid_Fuel_Man

Sorry, it was a wethead comment, not a steam comment per-se. I've yet to see a residential boiler undersized on a water system (per building heatloss). Under radiated: yes.

ChrisJ

Solid_Fuel_Man said:

Sorry, it was a wethead comment, not a steam comment per-se. I've yet to see a residential boiler undersized on a water system (per building heatloss). Under radiated: yes.

Even on hot water systems?
I always assumed oversized boilers was a steam problem. DIdn't realize it was happening in hot water as well.

That's sad.

If I had a hot water system I'd expect 100% run times from time to time as well as a degree or two indoor temperature drop during extremes. If I ever saw my burner cycling on super cold days I'd be annoyed.

Solid_Fuel_Man

It may also come from basically 98% of residential heat is oil here in the far northeast. Basically the lowest btu rating of oil is 70,000 and no one stocks a .5gph nozzle accept for mobile home nozzles for Miller furnaces. So that may have much to do with it. The "standard .85gph" and up are the norm.

Scott.Malo

I was fiscinated when I first learned why I would see windows open in all the buildings when it was 5 degrees outside when I rode the train into New York City. This is one of the primary reasons for installing Orifice Plates and TRV’s. When sized correctly (that’s the key), we can reduce the output of an oversized radiator and give the tenant some control. By limiting the thermostat to high limit (74 degrees perhaps) we can also dramatically reduce the energy consumption to heat the entire building. What this really ends up being is a culture change. Some people are going to feel “cold” that first heating season but when you move from Hawaii to Minnesota, it’s going to take a little while to acclimatize to the new temperatures.

aceboiler

I purchased the Lost Art book back in 93 i think?
When I read it, I got it. I had been working on boilers for several years prior to that. I starting sizing radiators thanks to the everydarnradiator book. I also had an old Glowcore book that had the EDR informaiton.
These posts and the books are real good info.
I did fix a one pipe steam system where the boiler had been replaced with one too small. Sized up the boiler to the EDR and worked like a charm.
I think I have reached a point in my troubleshooting career that when I read or figure out something I did not know I SMILE !
People ask me why I am smiling so much.......I just SMILE.
This forum along with the great articles makes me SMILE .
Thanks to you guys.

EdTheHeaterMan

I always loved this story. Dan told it in at least one of the seminars I attended. I never got the reference to inside air being unhealthy, the clean air movement and the reference to the Spanish flu, until Covid19 and the N95-Mask thing. It all comes together now. By the time I started in the business the outside air thing was ancient history, and IAQ was fixed with Electronic Air Cleaners, HEPA filters, Humidifiers and UV light bulbs in the ductwork. The idea of heating the home with the windows open was completely out of the question.

A lot has changed in 100 years, but the more stuff changes, the more it stay the same