steam newbie

matthtang

I purchased a 2 story home with a finished attic and partially finished basement in Madison, WI. The home currently is has a 2-piped gas powered steam system with 12 radiators. The attic is heated with three of the radiators but the basement is completely unheated. Ideally we would like to:
1) remove the chimney and sidewall vent the boiler/water heater since the chimney is affecting both our kitchen and bathroom renovation plans
2) move one radiator on the second floor 2-3 feet over so that we can have room for a closet in our master bedroom
3) replace the old cast iron radiator in the kitchen from floor level with a new low profile radiator, but have it attached 2.5-3 feet above floor level so that we can put it in functional kitchen cabinets below the new radiator.
4) add a radiator to the basement (preferably with the kitchen radiator to save money)
5) move the piping in the basement (if we do a hot water conversion) closer to the floor joists since the basement ceiling is currently only 6'6' high not including the steam pipes.

We had a heating guy come and check out our system. He said that a hydronic conversion would be very expensive since we'd have to re-pipe the whole house and that there was no way to get rid of the chimney. He suggested not moving the radiators and either use electric baseboard or completely getting rid of all heat in the kitchen and master bedroom. Given my online research, I'm not sure that he was very familiar with steam since he didn't increase the pressure and check for leaks on the current piping. (I do agree that moving the steam piping in the basement seems like a bad idea)

I understand that a conversion won't lower my gas bills significantly, but I was considering the conversion for the convenience and to increase the basement ceiling height. Should I consult another heating person? Does anyone on here have any good references for someone in madison, WI? (the find a contractor tool doesn't show anyone within 100 miles)

I currently am abroad for work so my mother (who isn't the most home-repair savvy person) was responsible for finding an showing the heating guy my new house.

Steamhead

Sounds like you have a Vapor system- the Cadillac of heating in its day, and still one of the best out there. Have you noted any trademarks on any of the original gear (besides who made the radiators)? Milvaco, O-E, Sterling and Trane are four possibilities- the first three were in Milwaukee, and Trane was in LaCrosse.

I would not even consider getting rid of the chimney. Yes, it can be done, but sidewall venting adds moving parts and increases the risk of something breaking down, which you don't want as cold as it gets in Wisconsin. You're far better off to adjust your renovation plans to work around the chimney.

Moving the one radiator may be easy, maybe not. I'd have to see what you're trying to do.

It is possible to run a steam main without pitch, as long as every takeoff comes off the bottom and is dripped to the return. This makes every takeoff a drain for condensate so it won't accumulate in the main and cause banging. The same could be done with the dry (overhead) return.

Forget about electric baseboard. It's way too expensive to run.

I sometimes come out to the Milwaukee area- maybe we could set up a consulting.

matthtang

Steamhead, much appreciated. How often do you make it to the milwaukee area? I'll have to get my mother or cousin to take pictures. Where are the trademarks usually located? (I assume not on the boiler since it was originally coal)

I'm definitely not in the mood to spend $10k+ on a conversion. (I was thinking it would be cheaper since i have a two pipe system) I still would like to get rid of the chimney since it greatly affects the remodel and because the chimney already needs repair. (I'm thinking it doesn't have a proper liner) We also have the mini-split as a backup heating source.