How to pitch a drop header?

curiousburke_2

I'm mapping out a drop header with two risers, and I have a question that is going to establish just how green I am. I'm assuming that for everything to thread together nicely the risers need to be the same length, and the two vertical drop pipes are also the same length (maybe that's a bad assumption). What do you do to pitch that first horizontal leg of the header? I can see it's easy to pitch a second leg of header if you put in an elbow .

Thanks Again!
Burke

ChrisJ

You cut the verticals slightly different lengths.

curiousburke_2

Ok, thank you! I was thinking maybe the difference was small enough that the shorter one just gets cranked tighter.

ChrisJ

curiousburke said:

Ok, thank you! I was thinking maybe the difference was small enough that the shorter one just gets cranked tighter.

This is what @KC_Jones just told me he did on his.
Apparently it can make a big difference.

KC_Jones

All I did was crank certain key joints a little more snug and got what I needed. A tiny bit in several joints can add up. I'm sure everyone has a method.

curiousburke_2

I guess there are many ways to skin a cat. I wanted to make certain there isn't a single accepted best way.

Speaking of many ways; have any of you guys that install lots of steam systems do funky headers just for the fun of it? Don't get me wrong, I am just running the header around the outside, but I was wondering if anyone ever passes it between the two risers with diagonals, or L's, or something whimsical just because they can.

EzzyT

No we don't do drop headers for the fun of it. To answer your question every boiler pipiping set up is different just like in these two pictures

EzzyT

curiousburke_2

Nice!

curiousburke_2

Admiring your pictures some more this morning, and I'm wondering if your comment was tong-in-cheek. It sure looks like you had fun getting creative on that second install. It looks really cool. I'm curious about the angle you used to attach the riser in the background. Do you have more pictures of that second install?

BTW, your first pic is very close to what I'm thinking for my system. Like that, I want my steam mains to come off my second leg of the header. I notice you shifted the foreground riser over with an L; is that to get a longer header? Do you think it would suffice to just connect directly, without the horizontal shift?

On your note of each setup being different. I have two steam mains 15" apart; should I strive to have the header parallel to those line those connections, or does it not matter.

EzzyT

That was the only option I had to pipe the header due to space being limited. If you could line the header up with mains then go for it, but it doesn't really matter.

curiousburke_2

I would like to pre-build the header, and give it to the plumber, he would do it, but I would enjoy it. I'm going to ask him to cut and thread he pipe for me. Do you have any advice for getting the fittings the right tightness? I'm using three inch risers and header.

ChrisJ

When tightening threaded connections you'll feel it goes fairly smooth, easy and consistent with each turn. Near the end, you're going to find it feel like it gets really hard to turn very fast, and much harder with each movement. This is where you want to be but don't go too far or you may cause fittings to not line up where you want. Basically you're feeling the tapered threads start to bind up. I would dry fit the connections by hand a few turns for each one before applying thread sealant. A bad fitting or bad threads on a nipple can ruin your day. Most should spin together 3 turns+ fairly easy by hand, if it goes 1 turn and binds up, use caution, it's a bad sign.

It's an art, and takes practice. Try not to use too big of a wrench for the size pipe you're doing as it makes it too hard to feel. For 3" pipe I used 48" wrenches, but I suspect 36" would've worked.

DO NOT USE CHINESE FITTINGS unless it's unavoidable.

ChrisJ

Also,
When fully tightened you want a few threads exposed, if you run out of threads that means either the fitting or pipe was threaded too deep and it may have not tightened enough.

Fred

If you have a Pro doing the job for you, tell him you want a drop header and let him design/build it for you. That way there is no question about any installation issues. He owns it or you own it. Not to sure shared ownership is a good idea, especially for you. I get it that you enjoy this kind of work, so enjoy watching the installer work his magic, or take the bull by the horns and tackle the job yourself. What you may see as "fun" these guys depend on for their livelihood. The good ones will do the job right and get out of your way. Focus your time on finding and hiring that "Good one". Things will work out much better for everyone. JMHO

curiousburke_2

Thanks everyone for the advice, and thanks ChrisJ for the directions. Do you use a bench vise or something to hold it while you screw thee next fitting in?

You're really right about ownership; I've "not learned" that lesson several times. This plumber is pretty good about it though. First job he did for me he taught me how to sweat copper and do PVC joints, then he checked my work. In this case though, leaks would be far more traumatic.

curiousburke_2

EzzyT said:

That was the only option I had to pipe the header due to space being limited. If you could line the header up with mains then go for it, but it doesn't really matter.

Well, I love that setup; it's so space conserving, which I really need. I'm going to show it to my plumber to see if he thinks that might work. I also like it because if two swing joints (verticle elbows) were used instead of that foreground horizontal elbow, it would allow for a lot of flexibility in both the thermal expansion and the initial fitting.

SWEI

curiousburke said:

I love that setup; it's so space conserving, which I really need. I'm going to show it to my plumber to see if he thinks that might work.

It all depends on the location of the existing mains. Pair that with the location of the boiler outlets and a workable header design will come forth.

adambnyc

curiousburke said:

Thanks everyone for the advice, and thanks ChrisJ for the directions. Do you use a bench vise or something to hold it while you screw thee next fitting in?

Most pros have a Ridgid tri-stand that they use. I'm sure you could use a table vice also provided its big enough.

I picked up a used one myself. I'm not a pro by any means but I deal with enough black pipe while doing my own gas and steam lines that it made sense.