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Flue and draft hood inquiry

Soulden
Soulden Member Posts: 10
Girlfriend just purchased home (Pa), and upon service technician visit, he stopped service as he noticed modifications were made to draft hood of furnace and followed to inform me that a new furnace is needed.
The modifications seem to be made of lower/weaker material, sealed with silicon glue.
Granted the furnace dates back to early 90s, but can a new draft hood be installed instead?
Pictures of what it currently looks like attached as I'm terrible at linking from image hosting site.

Any recommendations would be greatly appreciated.

Comments

  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 12,862
    edited January 2016
    Can you post pictures of the rest of the flue pipe and where it connects?


    First question I have is since when does an oil fired appliance have a drafthood?
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
    Soulden
  • KC_Jones
    KC_Jones Member Posts: 5,082
    Make and model of furnace would probably help also, for possible replacement parts.
    2014 Weil Mclain EG-40
    EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Boiler Control
    Boiler pictures updated 2/21/15
    Soulden
  • Soulden
    Soulden Member Posts: 10
    Sorry about delay, awkward positioning of ducts/pipes.
    First pic is coming out of hood and around corner.
    Second pic from corner to outside.
  • Soulden
    Soulden Member Posts: 10
    Is a Trane, model number LUSO85A948B , not sure if o or 0.
  • Soulden
    Soulden Member Posts: 10
    Glad previous owners keep manuals for everything installed on house, but sadly manual doesn't provide info on the model.
    Attached picture in case model number leads nowhere.
  • Soulden
    Soulden Member Posts: 10
    Just noticed
    "First question I have is since when does an oil fired appliance have a drafthood?"

    Now you have me wondering if I'm even asking the right question.
    My concern is the compartment/box/not sure what to call it, where flue pipe is attached, thats where the modification was made, and is the part that had the technician stop service.

    Can you even buy that part? Or is it usually custom made on furnace installation?
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 12,862
    Ah,
    So the technician didn't call it a drafthood? That's what confused me.

    The part is custom to the furnace. Whether or not it can be bought, that I don't know.

    My first question would be, why was it modified? it shouldn't have been, but what problem made someone do it?




    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • Soulden
    Soulden Member Posts: 10
    Sorry about the confusion on the first place.
    And yes the modification raises some questions. Would be nice if sellers had mentioned, if they were aware of the modification.

    I'm a little surprised the technician didn't offer any alternatives , but if following company protocol, guessing first order is the sales pitch, hard to tell.

  • KC_Jones
    KC_Jones Member Posts: 5,082
    FYI in PA the sellers are required and liable for disclosing anything they know about the property. Your girlfriend should have gotten a sheet filled out by them about everything they know about the property. If fact if I remember correctly that sheet needs to be displayed even when showing a house. I can't remember what info was on the sheet, but it might be worth keeping in mind if this starts getting ugly. I am hoping no reputable contractor did that work so it would be a homeowner install (again I hope). If they don't know either a previous owner did it and didn't tell or they did it and are lying. The problem with everything I just stated...proving they knew anything. Did she have a home inspection before she bought, if she did I will add this to the list of things I hate about home inspectors. BTW I too live in PA that's how I know about the disclosure papers. Here is a link to the current form, much longer than the one I got 13 years ago. She should have gotten a copy of this or at least seen a copy of this before buying.

    "This statement does
    not relieve the seller of the obligation to disclose a material defect that may not be
    addressed on this form. " In other words even if it's NOT on the form they are still responsible. Not sure if it's worth pursuing, just giving you the information. I would personally consider homemade parts on a heating appliance as a defect.

    http://www.dos.pa.gov/ProfessionalLicensing/BoardsCommissions/RealEstateCommission/Documents/Board Documents/Sellers Property Disclosure Statement.pdf
    2014 Weil Mclain EG-40
    EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Boiler Control
    Boiler pictures updated 2/21/15
  • Soulden
    Soulden Member Posts: 10
    edited January 2016
    Yeah, she got the disclosure documentation. And yes they lied, you can tell they had problems getting it service when last recorded services is dated to 1998. New furnace sounds like the best step to follow.

    And yes, she paid for home inspector and walked with him, he checked furnace and never mentioned a thing. I'm currently looking if they have any liability clause on the contract over him failing to catch it.
  • KC_Jones
    KC_Jones Member Posts: 5,082
    Inspectors have no liability don't even waste your time.
    2014 Weil Mclain EG-40
    EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Boiler Control
    Boiler pictures updated 2/21/15
  • Soulden
    Soulden Member Posts: 10
    Alright. Thanks for the advice.
  • captainco
    captainco Member Posts: 600
    Any contractor that thinks an oil furnace has a drafthood shouldn't be let back into the house!!! That the extension off the heat exchanger to connect the flue. Most likely it had rust holes in it and was patched. The flue should be in a negative pressure but I don't think silicone will handle the temperature of the oil furnace flue gases.
    I don't see any noticeable holes in the flue or collector box to indicate any type of combustion or draft test was taken. It is possible the previous home owners died? Just saying because I have been involved in that exact situation, or the people moved out because they were always sick and couldn't pay the mortgage.

    Furnace may be just fine but somebody that knows what they are doing needs to be called and that is rarely the oil company.


    ChrisJSouldenbilltwocase
  • Soulden
    Soulden Member Posts: 10
    "Furnace may be just fine but somebody that knows what they are doing needs to be called and that is rarely the oil company."

    I'm inclined to agree with your statement.

    Technician didn't even tried to service furnace.
    Guess they just lost what could had been a long term client. I mean is a 20+ years furnace, replacement would be needed before we pay mortgage off.

    Off topic:
    Sellers were on a good place/health/financial condition (young family), they already had purchased their next home and moving by the time we came for home inspection. And according to records, they lived the house for last 10 years.

    Would pass all your recommendations forward and really appreciate all the help.
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 12,862
    edited January 2016
    Soulden said:

    "Furnace may be just fine but somebody that knows what they are doing needs to be called and that is rarely the oil company."

    I'm inclined to agree with your statement.

    Technician didn't even tried to service furnace.
    Guess they just lost what could had been a long term client. I mean is a 20+ years furnace, replacement would be needed before we pay mortgage off.

    Off topic:
    Sellers were on a good place/health/financial condition (young family), they already had purchased their next home and moving by the time we came for home inspection. And according to records, they lived the house for last 10 years.

    Would pass all your recommendations forward and really appreciate all the help.

    @Soulden
    captainco teaches contractors this stuff for a living. He is without a doubt "the man" when it comes to burners and combustion.
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
  • SWEI
    SWEI Member Posts: 7,356
    Soulden said:

    Yeah, she got the disclosure documentation. And yes they lied, you can tell they had problems getting it service when last recorded services is dated to 1998.

    If the seller knowingly omitted material condition issues, you may have some recourse options.
  • billtwocase
    billtwocase Member Posts: 2,385
    edited January 2016
    This is called a flue collector. This furnace has been re-introduced since the 60's Texaco. You can try Borg-Warner or Ducane. That was the last ones I remember.
  • billtwocase
    billtwocase Member Posts: 2,385
    "Furnace may be just fine but somebody that knows what they are doing needs to be called and that is rarely the oil company."

    Let's not generalize here. It doesn't look or sound good to those of us who do the right thing on a daily and nightly basis
  • ChrisJ
    ChrisJ Member Posts: 12,862
    He said rarely not never and I'd say his comment is spot on. The fact you're always on here helping others for free suggests you do take your work seriously but I'd say you're the exception not the rule. I hope you advertise on here because oil needs more like you. Hell heating in general does.
    Single pipe quasi-vapor system. Typical operating pressure 0.14 - 0.43 oz. EcoSteam ES-20 Advanced Control for Residential Steam boilers. Rectorseal Steamaster water treatment
    billtwocase
  • billtwocase
    billtwocase Member Posts: 2,385
    Thank you for your kind words ChrisJ. It is a constant struggle with the gas men, and the unfortunately screwed customers that bash oil heat, and oil companies. Around here, there are pretty much full service oil companies, and a few oil peddlers. Just trying to stay competitive with fuel price is tough as everyone's overhead varies, so you gotta try and put yourself ahead of the rest with your service. We are a small family owned company in business for 52 years, and I have been there 32, my dad 24 years. Oil is my lifeblood. He may not have meant it for all companies, but guests that pop in on this site that are on the fence with a gas or oil choice, negativity can easily sway their vote. Again, thank you for the response and understanding
  • billtwocase
    billtwocase Member Posts: 2,385
    To the original poster, if you can get me a make and model#, I can make some calls Monday to see what is out there. It is hard to believe that it is rusted thru, Those flue collectors are thicker than most heat exchangers
    Soulden
  • billtwocase
    billtwocase Member Posts: 2,385
    looking around tonight
    Soulden
  • Soulden
    Soulden Member Posts: 10
    edited January 2016

    To the original poster, if you can get me a make and model#, I can make some calls Monday to see what is out there. It is hard to believe that it is rusted thru, Those flue collectors are thicker than most heat exchangers

    Make and model on picture above (5th post). I tried to look for more info, but manual only got a revision number on them, nothing else.

    Edit:missed the picture right below your comment.
    That was quick find.
    You can provide any more info to inbox. I'll run it with her and see if she is still interested on it.