GAS-FIRED BOLIER IN NEED OF SKIMMING

heatseeker1

I read a post that when the skimmer port looks like mine, it could spell disaster; something about needing two pipe wrenches to properly loosen the skim bolt. I've never had the boiler skimmed although a promise to skim it was made when it was re-piped this summer. It cycles on and off every ten minutes and runs for 120 seconds per cycle. It doesn't have a chance to heat the second floor before the cycle ends. My Honeywell thermostat is at least 27 years old, and works okay, but I have to set the heat anticipator to .5 because when I set it to .1 the length of the heating cycle is non-existent, (just the opposite of what the maker of the Dunkirk boiler recommends).

Does anyone know of a steam heating expert in the Philadelphia area who could quote me to skim my boiler? I had the near-piping corrected in July 2015 and was so excited to finally have that part done, however the water in the site-glass bounces up and down during operation at a ridiculous rate. With that kind of surging I don't think that the water ever gets a chance to really become steam. The boiler cuts off after about 120 seconds amd that's about when the water goes down really low in the site-glass. Would it be correct to assume that the short cycling is due to the surging and the dirty/oily boiler water? Please advise. Thanks.

KC_Jones

It sounds like the surging is causing the boiler to trip on low water. Can you contact the person that repiped it to do the skimming? If they piped it right I would have to guess they know what they are doing? What does the rest of the piping look like now? If it's "cycling" on low water that technically isn't a heating cycle. The heating cycle lasts as long as the thermostat is calling for heat. Need to be specific about what is going on so we can help. I suggest starting with the skimming and go from there. Have you considered doing it yourself? If that piping was just done this year that plug should unscrew fairly easily. Skimming is a fairly DIY friendly job in my opinion.

heatseeker1

I would love to do it myself. :-) I need to purchase a special hose correct? Also how hard do you think it will be for me (a female) to unscrew that connection? The new piping was done by one of the best, so I doubt that the piping is the culprit. I'll definitely start with the skimming. Thanks for your help!

BobC

That pipe looks like it has pipe dope so it should come apart without to much trouble with a pipe wrench. Usually a pipe, and a valve is added so you can slowly skim off the oils on the water, you can buy the pipe nipple and valve but you have to know what size pipe your dealing with.You sould also add a threaded plug so nobody gets scalded if the valve is operated with the boiler under pressure.

I would call the installer and ask him to set up a skim port for you and explain how to skim.

Bob

heatseeker1

Thanks for the instructions. Unfortunately the installer won't be coming back, so I guess I'll try the DIY approach.. Which area of the pipe do I measure in order to determine the correct size?

BobC

Is that a Utica style boiler with the steam outlets on the sides of the boiler?

Measure the diameter of the small plug and the diameter of the adapter that goes between the T fitting and that plug at the end. On some boilers you want to use the largest possible pipe but on others you are best using the smaller diameter so you can be sure you are skimming all the boiler sections.

With that kind of pipe compound the pipes should come apart without to much of a fight with a 18 - 24" pipe wrench. Make sure you take a 3 point bite so you don't distort the plug or the adapter.

Then you thread in a pipe nipple, a full port ball valve, and a pipe plug using pipe compound.

https://us.v-cdn.net/5021738/uploads/posts/14312/Smith skiming 10-13.jpg

That picture will show you what the skim setup on my Smith boiler looks like, the location is different than your boiler but the parts are the same.

Let us know what you find

Bob

vaporvac

I'm a girl and this is definitely something anyone can do... it doesn't require any strength if that's what you're asking. I put in my own skim port, and imagine you should be able to if you go slowly and use pipe dope,, tape and put in the full port valve. That's key for ease of use. You'll need to skim multiple times as more oils come down with use. I installed mine 1 1/2 yrs ago and I still got stuff out just this afternoon. Colleen

heatseeker1

My boiler is a Dunkirk. I've had it for about 23 years. It was never piped in correctly, until this past summer. Attached is a picture of what it used to look like. Now that I have had it re-piped, I can't wait to get the oil/sludge out. I appreciate the picture of what the connection should look like. That is very helpful. And much thanks to the lady for giving me the inspiration to DIY. I needed that! Thanks everyone. I'll let you know how I make out.

j a_2

Can you post a few more pics of the near boiler piping...

heatseeker1

Bob,
Are you anywhere near the Philadelphia area?
I'm hesitant about trying to install the apparatus needed to skim the boiler. Unlike your boiler, mine is squeezed into a corner very near my hot water heater. I don't even know if I have enough room to get into the area where the port has to go. I am so afraid that I am going to screw something up.
I take it based on your response above, that you the skim port in yourself.

BobC

I'm just south of Boston, anybody familiar with plumbing can handle this. The only tough part might be getting the plug out of that fitting and clearing that water heater.

Once you get a skim port in it's easy to do the skimming, it just takes some time and that is why some contractors don't want to do it.

That piping looks a bit odd, give us a few more pics showing the piping over the boiler from a couple of different angles.

Bob

Abracadabra

Yeah, quite odd. I don't see how the front riser meets the back riser into a header. Are both those pictures posted the same boiler? Was work done after the first picture?

heatseeker1

Bob,
Here's a picture of the piping over the boiler.

Abracadabra

Looks to me you already have a skim port.

BobC

That makes sense now and it looks like there is room on that front boiler outlet to put a skim port on, they may have to use a 45 to clear the tank.

Bob

Fred

The near boiler piping looks pretty darn good, actually. He does have a skim port. Just needs to get that plug out which should be really easy, even though it is close to the water heater, it was obvioulsy put in when they repiped the boiler and shouldn't take any effert to remove it.

heatseeker1

Yes, I have a bolt coming off of a pipe on right side of the boiler but I now need to install a pipe, a pipe nipple, a full port ball valve, and a pipe plug so that I can skim off the oil and dirt. Here's another picture of the overhead piping.

Fred

you don't actually need to do anything to skim it other than take that plug out and start skimming, very, very slowly, to be effective. The nipples, ball valves etc are an added convienance but not necessary. Whe you are done skimming, just put the plug back in and use teflon tape to help make it easy to take out the next time you want to skim.

heatseeker1

Okay so in other words, I should just unscrew that first plug (picture below) and then what next? How can I control the speed of what's going to come out of that plug? I know to turn the boiler off so that it will be cool when I undo the plug, but doesn't a hose or something have to be put up to or into the opening in order to avoid a Niagra Falls type reaction?

Fred

That plug is above the water level in the boiler. When you remove it, nothing will come out. You will put a bucket under it and use themanual water feed to slowly add water to the boiler until water starts to trickle out of that opening. adjust the water feed so that the water stream is no larger that the diameter of a pencil, a little less is better. allow the water to trickle out into the bucket. I like to skim four or five 5 gal. buckets worth but that's probably more than necessary.

heatseeker1

Fred,
Thank you, thank you, thank you. You just made my night! Those were the instructions that I so needed to know! Bless you!

Fred

You're welcome. BTW, when you are done skimming, shut the manual water supply off, put the plug back in and lower the water level in the boiler back down to its normal level. With all that done, turn the boiler on and let it run for 15 minutes or so to get rid of the excess oxygen that the fresh water has in it. you may find that you have to skim the boiler again in a week or two as oils from any new piping continue to return to the boiler water. That is normal.

pjnick

aren't you supposed to skim the boiler with the water hot ? I was told to run the boiler to the point just before it makes steam , then start the skimming process

BobC

I usually do it cold and then hot, I figure I'll get any oil floating on top with the cold and then let it heat up till just below boiling and do another skim.

Bob

Fred

Some do it hot, others do it cold, some do it both ways. I have always done mine hot but it's a matter of personal preference. I'm not sure one is any better than the other.

heatseeker1

Do I turn the plug forward or backwards to open it?

vaporvac

Righty-tighty, lefty-loosy. That's how I always remember it.

heatseeker1

Thanks. Is that the standard for everything except for the internal nut that keeps your toilet bowl handle in place?

heatseeker1

One more question...... Some of my valves are mounted on the right-hand side (truly it's the left if I were to turn my back to the radiator, but you know what I'm saying when I say right) and I think that when I turn it toward me, that that's the open direction. What about when the valve is mounted on the left of the radiator? Since the valve handles are not facing me, like the face of a clock, I get a little confused.

heatseeker1

Here's a couple of pics

Fred

There should be an arrow on the top of the knob that points to open and close.

vaporvac

Ditto what Fred says. R-tight,l-osse is the general rule.
Off-topic, but I LOVE your floors Are those bathroom? Lucky you!

heatseeker1

Yes, those pics are from the bathroom. :-) Which of these two knobs is original equipment? Now I see what you are saying, one has the arrow, the other is unmarked.

Fred

When you turn the knob and in the direction that causes the stem to extend further out of the vavle body, That is open. When turning the knob screws the valve stem into the valve body, that is close.

BobC

Just be aware that old valves sometimes don't close fully and that can trap water in the radiator which can cause water hammer.

Bob

heatseeker1

Bob,
What is the function of the valve? I have a two-pipe system. Does steam come up through the valve and return through the trap? What if the valve were completely closed, does that mean that that particular radiator would not emit any heat?

BobC

The steam does come through the valve and the condensate goes through the trap. If the valve does completely close the radiator would not heat (it might get warm but shouldn't get hot..

Actually what i said about trapping water would not be true because it is a two pipe system - sorry about that.

Bob

heatseeker1

Bob, no problem. I'm learning a lot. And Fred thanks for that easy to remember rule regarding the length of the stem.