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Running a Mod / Con On Generator ?

Danscrew
Danscrew Member Posts: 130
As anybody ran a Mod / Con on generator power other then Honda's inverter generators? They dont like dirty electric?

Comments

  • Paul48
    Paul48 Member Posts: 4,469
    There were quite a few people that could not run theirs with a generator, after Sandy. Unless you're running pure sine wave, I wouldn't try.
  • clammy
    clammy Member Posts: 3,103
    I have a buddy that runs his htp munchkin on a pos gas generator and does not have apromblem .I have seen guys use a resister on the line that feeds the boiler and it seemed to stop the coding issues and this was on a higher end whole home gen.In the past i spoke w some one about this and they had stated that if run shall aplug in electric heater that is powered off the generator ,that this will help the sitituitionby putting a small constant load on it ,help even out voltage and current drops and spikes .I personally have tryed it but its worth a shot ,i ll find out the hard way peace and good luck clammy
    R.A. Calmbacher L.L.C. HVAC
    NJ Master HVAC Lic.
    Mahwah, NJ
    Specializing in steam and hydronic heating
  • Danscrew
    Danscrew Member Posts: 130
    Yes you could do damage. does any body make a filter between the generator and the load to clean it up?
  • clammy
    clammy Member Posts: 3,103
    As it was explained to me the constant load of a small electric space heater.It was enough to help a prestige mod con run without coding on a crappy construction gen for a power outage .I would think a decent Hi end surge proctector would give you some protection but i believe that most controls can handle a min and max voltage in there design .Peace and good luck clammy
    R.A. Calmbacher L.L.C. HVAC
    NJ Master HVAC Lic.
    Mahwah, NJ
    Specializing in steam and hydronic heating
  • Paul48
    Paul48 Member Posts: 4,469
    Search....Pure sine wave vs. Modified sine wave
  • FranklinD
    FranklinD Member Posts: 399
    Yep. I remember all sorts of issues with modified-sine inverters 15 or so years ago, melting down battery pack chargers, they'll make clocks run fast, and motors and compressors have trouble starting on them. (I worked for a family company that designed and installed solar/wind electric systems as a teenager Into my early 20's). We got around the motor starting issues with small capacitor banks. Smoothed out the steps in the mod-sine waveform just enough.

    We don't lose power here often, but when we do, it's usually -20*f. Perishables are easy enough when the back entryway is cold...just shuffle stuff around out of the fridge. The boiler, however...

    I have an ancient ProSine 1000 watt inverter I use ('pure' sine wave). It's pushing 14 years old but works great, and is relatively small. I use it with a pair of 64 watt UniSolar panels (also 16-17 yrs old), a homemade charge controller, and some deep cycle marine batteries to power lights and the door opener in my garage.

    The way I have the boiler wired isn't exactly 'code' but it guarantees that one source can't back feed the other, which is most important to me. But basically, I just run a 75' 12ga extension cord from the garage to the boiler in the basement (a Burnham ESC) and it powers it just fine (circ, draft inducer, electronics). I've found that once running, the draw is pretty minimal, especially with a BumbleBee circ on Speed 1. I have about 400 amp/hr of storage total, plenty for a few days assuming zero sun input.

    We can also plug in a few lamps (CFL's), phone chargers, etc. That little inverter has been a workhorse for me. And I see when I check now, the price is less than a quarter of what it was when I bought mine. Ah, technology.
    Ford Master Technician, "Tinkerer of Terror"
    Police & Fire Equipment Lead Mechanic, NW WI
    Lover of Old Homes & Gravity Hot Water Systems
  • Danscrew
    Danscrew Member Posts: 130
    I read a story of a guy who used a 120 volt inverter off his car to heat his house. Had to leave the car running. The power lines were down for days . What ever you gota do to survive He saved the house from freezing up .
  • BobC
    BobC Member Posts: 5,476
    I used to work for the post office and some of our equipment used top of the line APC sine wave UPS's for the computer systems (4ea 12v gel cells) that were very good. They too were pretty dear but I'll bet they were better built than most of the stuff that's for sale now.

    BTW I just picked up a couple of LED shop lights at HD that put out 3200 lumens with an energy draw of 35 watts. That's a lot better than a CFL and they didn't cost any more than a decent shop light. They work great in a garage or cold cellar.

    Bob
    Smith G8-3 with EZ Gas @ 90,000 BTU, Single pipe steam
    Vaporstat with a 12oz cut-out and 4oz cut-in
    3PSI gauge
  • TomS
    TomS Member Posts: 62
    I have used a cheap generator several times a year for the past seven years with no problems on a Knight KBN105 with no problems.
  • FranklinD
    FranklinD Member Posts: 399
    Bob -

    I recently (finally) splurged on some decent, LED 40 watt equivalent bulbs. 6.5 watts. I used them for my porch fixtures and back door light...I had a cfl out there but it was slow to light in the cold, despite cold weather ratings.

    So far so good. Good color temperature too.
    Ford Master Technician, "Tinkerer of Terror"
    Police & Fire Equipment Lead Mechanic, NW WI
    Lover of Old Homes & Gravity Hot Water Systems
  • Paul48
    Paul48 Member Posts: 4,469
    Franklin......You probably already, but if you can get your hands on some 6v golf cart batteries, they are perfect for your set up. I've been doing some research for a friends camp, and, with exceptions, every piece for an off-grid set up is $200. No matter how ya slice it.
  • FranklinD
    FranklinD Member Posts: 399
    My original system had 4 Trojan T105's. Great batteries. Someday I'll work on building a full system now that we're in our 'forever' house finally.

    My old employer still runs 100% of his loads on solar and wind, has been for 30 years now. 10 Kyocera panels, a 3kW Whirlwind wind genny, and a 32volt, 4000 amp/hr battery bank (each cell is a 2v, 2000 amp/hr phone company switch station battery -- amazing). And a 4kw Heart Interface (modified sine) 32-120 inverter. He has an oil furnace, electric dryer, and electric water heater, and runs them all (just 2 people, though, not a family of 5) off the batteries and various homemade converters. Fascinating guy. He originally (early 80's) picked 32vdc for the system due to the availability of 32 volt bulbs to use for lighting. Locomotive bulbs.
    Ford Master Technician, "Tinkerer of Terror"
    Police & Fire Equipment Lead Mechanic, NW WI
    Lover of Old Homes & Gravity Hot Water Systems
  • BobC
    BobC Member Posts: 5,476
    That sounds like a fascinating system. Those station batteries should last forever.

    I wonder if you can get 32v LED bulbs at a reasonable cost?.

    Bob
    Smith G8-3 with EZ Gas @ 90,000 BTU, Single pipe steam
    Vaporstat with a 12oz cut-out and 4oz cut-in
    3PSI gauge
  • Paul48
    Paul48 Member Posts: 4,469
    I wish I didn't have the tree cover here. I'd probably go grid-tie with micro-inverters.
  • Jean-David Beyer
    Jean-David Beyer Member Posts: 2,666
    I have not tried this yet, but after storm Sandy, I got a 12 KW natural gas fueled backup generator. One of these:

    http://www.kohlergenerators.com/home-generators/products/14RESA

    They claim the output is pretty good.

    "Premium power quality delivers exceptional digital voltage and frequency regulation along with low levels of harmonic distortion to protect sophisticated electronics "

    I am expecting a serious blizzard tonight, with a high likelyhood of power failure, so I may have an answer sometime tomorrow.

    I do not know why the power from a backup generator needs to be especially pure to run a boiler, even a mod-con. The power supply steps the voltage down to what is needed, and rectifies it to DC of the needed voltage(s). The rectified power should be filtered, an easy job if they have a competent engineer to design the power supply.