TriangleTube Install

danfrmmaine

Hi, Hooking up TT Prestige Excellence soon, however haven't found anyone in the area to do the install yet. I would like to open up the discussion to plumbing it directly to a home run manifold to reach out to 10 panel radiators. I would like to eliminate the primary/seondary piping. One zone with thermostats on each radiator and a differential bypass valve. Concerns? pros/cons. One installer mentioned boiler getting too hot with primary only. Not sure I understand that. Thanks in Advance

Dan in Midcoast Maine

JStar

TT

The manufacturer's information will tell you if primary/secondry is needed based on the total restiction of the system. My guess is that it will be necessary. The only time we can eliminate P/S piping is on an old gravity system, with incredibly low head-loss.

Rich_49

Smallest load

what do you expect it to be ?  P & S may be necessary but can be done in a better fashion for your particular application . Hydraulic separation for what you are doing would be more beneficial with a small buffer tank . Constant circulation on the emitter side and a small circ on the boiler side . This will provide the situation where your TT can really perform to it's capabilities while preventing short cycles .

Where in Maine are you located ?

danfrmmaine

TT

Well the manual states I can use the boiler circulator to run a single zone load if head loss is not too high. Pump has 3 speeds and available system head ranges from 1.7 to 14.2 based on delta T and speed of pump. I guess I need to figure head loss from a system with 1 inch pipe to manifold with 10 loops of 1/2 pex. ?

danfrmmaine

TT

Between Augsta and Rockland Mainei Any ideas for installers?

Thannks

danfrmmaine

TT

So question to Triangle tube:

Can I use the internal circulator of the prestige 110 to supply heat directly to a hydronic system using zone valves?

Answer:

Yes, as long as the system head loss is within the operating flow rate range of the circulator



Ok now how do I find out if the head loss is within the operating flow rate range of the internal circulator?

Rich_49

Math

you have to determine the highest head loss zone , all segments must be added . That is the head loss you must overcome and as for GPM it would be the total required flow when all rads are calling

heatpro02920

Do yourself a favor

Run the system pri/sec... The circ is already there..



Dan, are all the rads in one room?



I would pipe this this way...



Do the math for your rads, see what they want for flow, I would guess depending on the size brand ect. you would rather not have a 10 loop manifold...



I would run 2- 5's maybe even 2-3's and a 4 loop depending on the rooms layout...... come out of the boiler with 1" and run 2 or 3 http://www.supplyhouse.com/Webstone-58643-1-x-3-4-Pro-Pal-Full-Port-Brass-Ball-Valve-w-Reversible-Handle-Primary-Secondary-Loop-Purge-Tee-600-WOG purge tees for your secondaries... a circ on each manifold and never have an issue...

danfrmmaine

ok

I will try to get someone to install it that way. Guess I should put a bypass valve on each manifold? How about a buffer tank on the primary loop. I just have a hard time imagining low return temperature in that primary loop to achieve condensation. Man could I use a real pro up here in Maine. Thanks everybody

heatpro02920

What are you expecting for supply temps?

What is your heat loss for the building and then each zone separately?



You need to figure these things out first, then properly size your emitters to the room and you boiler... Is this boiler just taking care of low temp heating or is it also going to be taking care of high temp also?



If it is all low temp, then you don't need any mixing valves, the internal tank will work on priority so the high temp dhw wont mix {much} with the low temp panels. So no bypasses needed... Ill find you a drawing from my list, I think I have one identical to what you are trying to do..



The attached drawing will be similar, your boiler circ will be internal with the excellence... I would consider having a tankless installed and going with a solo instead of an excellence... This will allow you to properly size your boiler, if you need 110K btu that is fins but it must be a large home... I have 2000sq ft homes with solo 60s in them that never go cold...

danfrmmaine

well

heat loss has been difficult to calculate. Gutted timberframe farmhouse that I reinsulated, installed radiant reflective layer And strapped for air space between sheetrock and foil. Pretty darn air tight but still an old farmhouse. All new windows etc, 2300 square feet two story. Granite foundation. Have not found installer that would do a heat loss calculation. I thought I was correct with the PE 110 years ago when I bought it. I'm sweating right now just thinking how big it is! We use wood heat too. High heat only. Probably 150-160 degrees supply. Read alot of posts about using internal circulator to push heat through panels seemed simple and efficient. Bob at NRT agreed. Have yet to convince myself internal pump would work alone without P/S. 10 years now with woodstove only. Not sure what to do next. thanks