Welcome! Here are the website rules, as well as some tips for using this forum.
Need to contact us? Visit https://heatinghelp.com/contact-us/.
Click here to Find a Contractor in your area.
Diverter Tee ID
I'm looking a a diverter tee system that looks to have been modified a few times and is a bit hacked. the Tees with rings are easy to sort out but some have arrows and the "supply tee" on one side and "Thrush" on the other. There is nothing at Thrushes website about these. It seems like the because it says "Supply Tee" the the Tee should be on the inlet side of the radiator and the arrows point with the flow.
Do I have this right?
Do I have this right?
Went back and got a picture
Should have took one to start with0
As long as the flow is going in the direction of the arrows, and the other tee is connected downstream of the "supply tee, it won't matter if it is on the supply side or the return side. The water should get hot wherever that pipe goes to the radiator.
You say that the system was "Hacked"? Were any radiators disconnected and orphan tees left in place or just capped off? It can slow down the flow. If that is a problem, connect the tees together, giving the restricted flow a path to lowering restriction. Or remove the tees. I'd prefer trying connecting the tees first.
Thrush tees were really "Scoop Tee's" and add a lot of restriction if orphaned. I don't think that B&G Mono flow venturi tees add as much restriction.0
yes, there is one capped Tee. Its not were a rad was removed, it is on the last rad in the loop and apparently it was not getting hot enough so someone capped the thrush tee and put a newer B&G Tee in the middle of the system to bring warmer water over to this rad. so in this case to fix it, we will remove the old Tee to remove the restriction. (or remove the new tee and restore the original...)
There is also some odd staggering of of mono flows that don't look like any arrangement I have read about. right now we are sketching the system so we can make sense of it.
There are some of the standard problems I have learned about here: relatively new, way over-sized cast iron boiler boiler and not pumping away.
It looks like it was originally a nice old school mono-flow system that was added too, to put heat into a remodeled basement and put heat to the second floor which originally did not have heat. So now some of the rads don't get very warm unless you drain the cold water out via the vent There is a mix of the original rads, CA baseboard and fin tube baseboard
it belongs a young man who works for me, has a few kids and is on a tight budget. right now I just want to help him figure out the "must dos" and then a longer term plan as funds come available. I think the must dos are to get that lone monoflo tee out of the picture and get the circulator "pumping away"
Thanks for replying0
Low Boiler Temp
We were making a sketch of the system this weekend and the system go a call for heat. I noticed that the boiler gauge never got above 155F. Pressure was 20 PSI.
This seems bad to me, if the boiler is at 155, how low is the return temp...
The last radiator in this system barely get warm which leads me to believe the return temp is probably low.
Could the capped off Diverter Tee cause this much of a problem?
The boiler is a Williamson OWT-3 series 1 Oil burner
IBR rating BTUH = 78,0000
I think that I missed this post. Sorry.
When you carefully note and draw out the system, be sure that there are no series looped sections of baseboard connected in the Monoflow system loop/zone. Any fin tube baseboard must be put together on its own zone. The fact that you have radiators that don't get hot, and you have to bleed them to get them hot usually says that something is piped wrong. Understand that the intent of "One Pipe Systems", was to share the large amount of water in each radiator so that the radiators got warm together. And that the main still has some residual hot water in it when it got back to the boiler after running for a time. I have seen where someone has taken multiple radiators and series looped them. The first radiator was roaring hot and the last one was still cold. Copper fin tube baseboard has very little water in them Radiators have large amounts of water. That's why each and every radiator had its own set of Monoflows. I don't have all my rules anymore but as I remember, more than 15' round trip meant that you had to pipe the radiator with 3/4" pipe. Baseboard heaters more than 15' long had to be 3/4" pipe. To get adequate flow through the larger baseboard.
It doesn't matter if the Monoflow zone feeds a second floor, as long as the main is sized properly, and all the radiators are connected properly. Most Monoflow systems left the boiler as 1 1/2" or 1 1/4" pipe but split to the next lower size to equalize the flow. In many old houses, you can split it up and install zone valves on the split side and have two zones with the same piping. It works really well for budget conscious customers or friends.
Having orphaned tees in the mains isn't the end of the world that some make it out to be. They shouldn't be there, but in my experience, they aren't the end of the world. I had a customer that had a Monoflow/radiator system put in to a old antique house, one zone on two floors. Split, 1 1/2" out of the boiler, 1 1/4" on the split. Unfortunately, the single loops took care of two floors. But I split it anyway with zone valves and controlled each half of the house. There was a radiator in the Master Bedroom that I never knew didn't work. For years, when I would open the house in the spring, I would have to drain a lot of water out of this one radiator for it to start to get warm. Years later (recently), after the owner was complaining of being cold in her bedroom, I realized that it DIDN'T get hot no matter how long the thermostat ran. When I checked it out, the 1964 installers had left a bunch of Monoflow sets on the mains for future connections that were never made. But the radiator in question was connected to two straight tees. I connected it to a spare Monoflow and there was never a problem again.
I know what everyone is saying about circulator location. This and almost every monoflow system I have ever seen or worked on had the circulator on the return. If you wish to create a piping Picasso and re-do the piping, far be it for me to discourage you. I personally would correct any and all other problems in your piping first. You may find that the piping works fine. And they all ran on a B&G Series 100, Taco 110, and/or replaced with a Taco 007. As is the above job.
One other thing. Because I had this problem with a few radiators on the above job. If you have radiators, they usually have a union valve ell. They always had a steel clip under the handle to hit the open and close stop. Age and weeping stems has usually caused them to rust away. Then, there is absolutely no way to know when the valve is open and the water flowing through the radiator. There's usually just a paddle inside and a 1/4 turn is all the difference between full open and full closed. And the symptoms are the same as you describe when you have to bleed the radiator. The cheap repair is to take the handle off, drain the system, and note when the paddle is in the open position. Then cut a notch in the top of the stem so you can tell which way the paddle is located. The stem head is square. Get the whole main system working before you start changing the boiler. If that doesn't solve your problems, you will be frustrated.
I hope this is helpful.0
A Williamson OWT boiler should have a tankless heater. If you have a tankless, you need to raise the boiler water settings. Even if you don't, raise it to see what happens. Raise the High Limit to at least 180*. Set the Low or Low Limit Circulator to 160 degrees or 20 degrees differential. Once you get the system working properly, you can play with the temperature settings. When the thermostat closes, the boiler controls will switch to 180 degrees.0
Thanks for your very informative reply! As far as the boiler goes it does have a tank-less and it is piped but he uses a separate tank-less water heater. So the one on the boiler is isolated.
Does your handle, "Icesailor" have to do with previous career?0
- 121.3K All Categories
- 84K THE MAIN WALL
- 2.9K A-C, Heat Pumps & Refrigeration
- 53 Biomass
- 417 Carbon Monoxide Awareness
- 40 Chimneys & Flues
- 1.7K Domestic Hot Water
- 4.8K Gas Heating
- 119 Geothermal
- 155 Indoor-Air Quality
- 3K Oil Heating
- 56 Pipe Deterioration
- 772 Plumbing
- 5.4K Radiant Heating
- 362 Solar
- 14K Strictly Steam
- 3K Thermostats and Controls
- 51 Water Quality
- 626 Buy, Sell, Barter
- 38 Industry Classes
- 73 Job Opportunities
- 19 Recall Announcements