Cold radiator puzzler

Hox

Furthest rad on second floor is very difficult to get heated up. Steam just doesn't want to get to the end of the system. Any ideas further than what I have done below?



Here are my stats:

1928 house - 1800 sq.ft., 2 story, well insulated

Boiler - 2 year old Utica (PEG 150CDE), BTUH Input = 150000, DOE Heat Cap. = 120000

Single pipe system

Honeywell Pressuretrol - PA404A - set to .5 cut in and 1 on differential wheel

Thermostat - Honeywell T87, heat anticipator set to 1.2

Air valves - Hoffman Specialty Manufacturing, No.1A. Valves all seem to work freely, 1st floor set to 1 (slow) and furthest rad on 2nd floor set to 6 (fast)

Other - Basement 7x2 rad turned off, 1 small rad in hall turned off along with 1 in small bath



Thanks, Monty

nicholas bonham-carter

Slow radiator

What sort of main vents are on the system?--NBC

Hox

Cold Radiator Puzzler

Vents are Hoffman No.75H. One on each of the two main lines

nicholas bonham-carter

Too slow main vents

You need the air to get out with no resistance, and therefore a big vent(vents) is needed. The Hoffman 75 is a third of the capacity of the Gorton 2.--NBC

Hox

Too slow main vents

Can I replace just the vent on the line where I'm experiencing the problem....or do both need to be replaced?

nicholas bonham-carter

Balancing the resistance

You are better off replacing both vents with the same higher capacity main vents.

This should fill both supply lines with steam, before the steam begins to rise into the radiators. The balancing of the system here is really that of balancing the resistance of escaping air. This will let you get your pressure into the ounces range. A low back-pressure on the main venting,(2 ounces), and slightly higher back-pressure on the individual radiator vents is a winning combination. Later some radiator vents may need enlarging if they are on the top floor, or on long run-outs.--NBC

Hox

Balancing the resistance

This makes a lot of sense to me. The line that is slow to heat at the end has 11 rads. The other line has only 3. Will try the Gorton 2 as recommended.



another question.....I have been trying to deal with this issue by shutting down certain rads.

1 small one in main hall where stat is located, 1 small in bath very close to stat...and the very large (7'x2') ceiling rad in the basement. We don't feel lacking for heat in these areas.

However, would like to know best strategy for managing heat bill. For example, is it better to have all rads open and then manage balance via the air valves. Would this help or hurt the gas bill?

MDNLansing

Only Option

Closing the valves on single pipe systems causes issues. You should leave them all open. If you must shut down a radiator, turn the air vent upside down. This will prevent air from escaping and steam from entering. However, shutting down radiators changes your EDR. Your boiler is sized to fill all radiators with steam. Even if you reduce the steam volume in the system, the boiler will still generate the same amount of steam. This can lead to issues itself. You're not saving any money by closing a few radiators because your boiler is still filling the mains and takeoffs with the same amount of steam and building the same amount of pressure. Regardless, leave the valve open no matter what.

Hox

Thanks

Thanks gentleman. I feel like you guys have given solid advise. Gonna get those Gorton 2s on order asap. Also, I never felt good about shutting off the rads. Glad to get confirmation that they should be on.



Much appreciation,

Monty

Hox

Thermostat tweaking

Ok, per the recommendations above....and the Gorton "house diagram" found on Pexsupply....I have installed Gorton 2 on the long pipe and Gorton 1 on the short one. Also, added Gorton #6 vents on 2 rads at furthest points (second story). Other Hoffmans on 2nd story set to "fast"...Hoffmans on 1st floor set to "slow".



Currently rads on 2nd floor seem to be getting hot just fine. My temps are staying very consistently 68 on 1st floor and 65 on second floor. Wondering if I can get this more balanced by adjustment at the stat (Honeywell T87). Is there a good method for making adjustments? How do I know when it is set right?

Thanks, Monty