Outside tank info Removal & Install

70BUICK

Bear with me.  I was told by my home oil supplier that he could NO longer deliver to me because my 275 gal. oil tank is buried outside underground beside the house, because of insurance risks.  Okay --here are my concerns/questions & Problems. My first concern is that If  I place it outside on a pad, will I have issues with freezing ( I live in  Massachusetts). Are their additives I can put in during the winter months --- or  Is their a "Heating blanket" / "glow plug"  or something that will keep the tank warm.

Putting inside would really be my last resort, only for the fact that my downstairs bathroom is finished, and would require me to relocate  my washer  & dryer  and re-route plumbing/ electrical/drains/vent etc.....

Cost:  Assuming their are "NO " issues / problems with leaking/ ground contamination etc... What should an Average  Removal & Install  of  a 275 Gallon tank cost in Massachusetts.



Thanks  JIM          FROM  MASSACHUSETTS          

STEVEusaPA

Some thoughts...

1. Inside is definitely preferred. Yes you could put in additives, put something around the fuel line, put something in the tank to heat the fuel, or get a heating oil/kerosene mix. They even make enclosures. Then after all that, unless you have an oil line heater at the nozzle, you could end up with cold fuel performance issues. A lot to go thru for an outside tank.

2. Keep in mind there are different styles of tanks with different footprints. They even make a vertical tank that stands on end, also check out Roth Tanks.

3. Site rules prohibit discussing price.

4. Tank removal can be pretty pricey

Btw, did anyone determine the tank is leaking? I think Mass. requires tank testing. Also, what does your insurance company say about the tank?

And finally, call another oil company. Many companies up there.

70BUICK

Outside tank info -------- Removal & Install

Thanks Steve, ----If I could put it  inside, half of my problem would be solved, Like I said -that will be my last option.     Granby is the name of the tank that I have discussed with 3 contractors.  $ 3,500 --$4,000 Thousand range to do the whole job.  As far as leaking,---we haven't tested soil or pressure tested it yet.       As far as MY insurance company, Metropolitan  they suck ---They WILL  NOT  give me any kind of letter, or stand behind me --- I am all on my own,  even though THEY knew the oil tank was  outside underground when I bought the house back in 1991. -  But they have no problem taking my monthly payments.   And finally, I will call around to other oil  delivery companies. maybe I ll get lucky and they will not have a strict policy or their insurance hasn"t come down hard on them yet.

   JIM                             FROM THE MASSHOLE STATE

Jean-David Beyer

What should an Average Removal & Install of a 275 Gallon tank cost

Here in New Jersey, the DEP disparately wants people to remove their underground tanks, so they pay you $1500 to do it. But that is all. Somewhere around 1980, my in-ground 275 gallon tank started taking on lots of water, so I had it removed and replaced with a 1000 gallon tank, so I needed to fill it at most once a year. In the summertime when prices were lower and when there was no emergency to get it filled. Any tank over 275 gallons was required to be in the ground for fire safety reasons.



So then when I thought it was old enough, and oil was around $4/gallon, I converted to gas, got a permit, and had the tank emptied and removed.It cost about the same as the DEP grant. The licensed contractor I had remove the tank was required to make some test borings and testing and it turned out the tank had been leaking. The contractor had no choice, so he notified the DEP immediately. They verified and I was required to have remediation done. I had an insurance company when I bought the house that did cover oil leaks, but they left the state and another insurance company took over their policies, but did not cover oil tanks. So the two insurance companies argued over who should pay, and the one that covered tanks said the tank was new when I got their policy, so most of it must have leaked when the second company took over. So they pro-rated it and the first company paid a very few thousand dollars, and the current company paid nothing. It took them several years with my old tank sitting on the ground in the front yard, getting the code enforcement officer (and the neighbors) pretty upset for my running a junk yard where zoning does not permit that.



The state of New Jersey has a grant program for oil tank remediation, and I seemed to qualify, So my contractor and I put in an application for about $45,000 to do the remediation, and after about 3 or 4 years they said I was near the top of the list, but that the state had not budgeted enough money, so there was none left. That would have been back in 2009. About a month or two ago, I was notified that I had to send in 3 pages of additional forms, which I did, and now at the end of 2013, I should get a very small check, and I am to submit itemized bills for the various stages or work: removing 5 holly trees, a juniper, a Japanese cherry, and a 50 year old azelia bush. Then they dig up the whole area and take it away to a licensed disposal facility, and replace the soil with junk dirt, with top soil on top of that. Then they will plant small trees to replace the old ones. Note that no two oil tank remediation jobs are the same, so there is no practical way to compare costs of one job to another without a pretty thorough engineering report describing the problems found that the work to be done.



First they made me put the tank in the ground, then they sort-of punish me for doing that.



So pray that your tank did not leak. And I hope Massachusetts is more generous than New Jersey. Well, actually New Jersey is pretty nice about having that grant program, but I think they had no idea how many oil tanks were out there leaking.

billtwocase

buried tank

First I will say that we don't discuss pricing here. Second, that tank should have been removed in 1995 when the state pushed to eliminate underground storage tanks per say.  We were installing about 2 a day back then. If you were informed correctly back then, you would had monitoring wells that your county would test yearly. Someone dropped the ball. Anyway, Steve is spot on. If choose to install outside, you will need a continuous cement slab to support it, treat it year round with frost preps,and depending on your town, a containment barrier, as we are required in my area. Heat tapes, etc, do nothing as your new supply line will be top feed. I would opt for an inside tank personally, but you gotta do what you gotta do. Good luck

Jean-David Beyer

If you were informed correctly back then,

Clearly, I was not informed at all back then.

The joys of home ownership!

70BUICK

outside tank info

Why can't pricing be discussed, its only smart to shop around and get estimates. No  one seems to have a problem with mentioning brands or suppliers names. Are contractors doing something shady. You can look up lowes / homedepot  for the same 2x4x8 and get comparison prices.  Anyway -- like I said, I bought this house in 1991, ( still here 2013)  and to this day NEVER received ANY notice from my Insurance company nor STATE/COUNTY or CITY saying I had to dig it up. . It was my oil supplier who notifeid me,  pretty sad.... If this "LAW" went into effect in 1995 ---what happened in those 18 yrs. ( Some politicans  palms must have gotten greased).   I don't now what state billtwocase  lives in, but it can't be MASSACHUSETTS.  ---There is the Right way --- the wrong way ---and the MASS. way---and unfortunetly  I have to play by Mass. rules

  JIM                                         Moving to Arizona

billtwocase

70Buick

I do live and practice here in Mass. I don't know if you have used the same company as an oil supplier, or shop around for oil.  Many underground tanks were never permitted, inspected, or tested, so those fell thru cracks, not greased palm. Any fuel supplier should have stopped filling that tank, if it was not in a vault, or had visible test wells, or proof of less than 20 years old, back in 95-96. This is what you get when you "shop" around. They only want there $$$, and off they go. Fortunate for you and whoever delivers your fuel, hopefully, there are no leaks or contamination. Like I said, no one knew, from the state, fire prevention, etc, that your tank was underground, or even a permit for fuel storage. I feel for you that the previous owner, any home inspector, pulled the wool over your eyes. Don't blame the state for wanting to try and prevent ground water pollution. As far as pricing,  I don't think Lowes or Home Depot removes and installs oil tanks, last I knew.  It is also an understanding on this site, and I think it states that.  No one trying to screw anyone by leaving that out

Bob Bona_4

how can

Pricing be discussed if no one has come to see your job? And especially a job involving a potential soil remediation where the end is not predictable. ..



Then all the varying regional costs from guys all over the country.



Common sense dictates if you have a burried steel vessel, its going to rust out and leak. As sure as death and taxes.