starting up gas boiler with portable generator or battery?

jim_14

When the recent storm hit ,I lost power for 2 days after being told it would be 7. Luckily we only had to deal with 2 nights of no power, and our gas fired hot water tank provided us with hot water for our showers.

But I realized that if the weather was colder we would have no way to run our 1 pipe gas steam boiler w/hot water tapped off for our basement.

So , my questions:

Im planning on buying a portable generator to run the refridgerator and a lamp or 2 in case we ever lose power for an extended period of time. I also would plan on being able to "start" and run my boiler for an hour here or an hour there to provide heat to my home. Its a rather small system, 105,000 BTU's for approx 290 sq ft of steam generation.

Can you guys who are experts give me an idea of watt wattage/amperage I would need to provide the power to run my boiler in case of an extended power outtage in the dead of winter? (Yes I am familiar with basic electricity and wiring and I am capable of opening the circuit and isolating the boiler from the emergency cut off switch and placing it back when power is restored- there would be NO back feeding of electric into to the panel!!)



Or is there a "battery" way of getting the boiler to run long enough to make heat for maybe 30 to 45 minutes assuming from a cold start? I know I could get a UPS but I dont know if that would last for a few days or up to a week if needed.

My goal here is to avoid a no heat situatution in the worst possible case in the winter months. I could live without lights and refridgeration and not having to store gasoline for a generator if a batter option was viable

thanks in advance for you help!

icesailor

Generators:

If you're going to do it, jump right in. No toe testing of the water.

Don't buy anything less than a 5 KW run set. And if two list the same output, if one has a bigger engine, buy that one. Get a Generator transfer switch and have it wired into your house panel with what you want to run. A 5 KW set will have a 20 Amp 4 prong twist lock connection on the set. The transfer switch will have one too. All you need is a long made up extension cord to do the connection. There will be no back feeding. It doesn't take a lot of energy to run your gas boiler. Or any boiler for that matter.

You can store the generator for when you need it.

I have a Kohler 5 Kw run, 6.3 Kw Peak Load set that I bought in the 1990's. It has a 12 Hp Thumper motor that is really strong. Basic. Pull start. But, it would run my whole house (just not all at once) run my heat, it would run a burner on the stove, but most importantly, it ran my water pump. We have horses and they can not go without water.

TonyS

Going to have to disagree

with Ice on this.

I live in an Area in PA that loses electric fairly often. Having gone through several different types of generators I can share some of my experiences

First off I do not live in a city with a natural gas main, if I did things would be different

I live in the country and we have been stranded here from deep snow with no electric for over 2 weeks already.

I need electric to pump water, light, maintain fridge,effluent pump,tv and dvd player,gas tankless water heater,

We heat with Geothermal...that stays off and heat comes from a wood stove.

We use a Honda 2000 watt inverter...EU2000i through a six circuit load center. A load center is a must, it allows you to isolate six circuits from the main panel and switch them to the generator, it also allows you to monitor amps.

We organize our water usage for showers by switching off everything but the pump and water heater, when finished we dump the effluent pump in the sand mound. Then we turn pumps off(water stored in extrol tank enough for toilet flushes and drinking) then the lights and fridge are left on.

We do all this and lead a pretty normal life on 1-1/2 gallons of fuel a day.

Fuel is a key factor for us. Normally whats in the cars and tractor can be enough for a few weeks.

Inverter generators...google it and you will learn alot. Main benefits QUIET, PURE SINE WAVE, ENERGY EFFICIENT.

Also because the honda is small and light, we actually use it for other things throughout the year. This keeps it maintained and fuel fresh.

Honda also makes another unit that couples together to double the wattage, called the companion. This is a great idea for high load periods and you can turn one off at night and also provides redundancy if one unit would fail.

You may be temped when looking to buy a cheaper unit....DONT.....Buy a Honda

http://powerequipment.honda.com/generators/

.

TonyS

Generators

Here is some good info on generators.

Note the problems with natural gas units!

jim_14

im in an area that doesnt lose power

on a regular basis.. Other then the 2003 blackout I cant remember the last time we lost power... But I dont want to be left out in the cold..

So I dont really need to do the whole house thing with a contraption at my main fusebox- my main concern is getting the heat on in the event we are faced with no electric in the cold winter and perhaps running a fridge in the summer should another northeastern blackout occur

jim_14

im in an area that doesnt lose power

on a regular basis.. Other then the 2003 blackout I cant remember the last time we lost power... But I dont want to be left out in the cold..

So I dont really need to do the whole house thing with a contraption at my main fusebox- my main concern is getting the heat on in the event we are faced with no electric in the cold winter and perhaps running a fridge in the summer should another northeastern blackout occur

TonyS

Natural gas inverter

Pick your inverter then buy or convert to hybrid.

http://www.generatorsales.com/order/Honda-EU3000iS-Tri-fuel.asp?page=EU3000iS_Tri_Fuel



http://www.propane-generators.com/honda-generators.htm



Make space in a open shed or build one for generator...pouring rain and snow often accompany outages.



Tri fuels are nice because you can still use the generator for other things.

AaronH

Truck/Battery Pack/Inverter Setup

We just spent four days running the house on the following setup:



(1) Xantrex 1800w Inverter

(2) Marine Deep-Cycle 4D (200amp-hour) 12v batteries, in parallel.

(1) Ford Ranger, 4cyl truck.



We ran the refrigerator, oil-fired single pipe steam and oil-fired hot water heater on about 1/2 of the pickup's 20 gallon fuel tank. The inverter/battery combo powered everything normally, silently. We ran the truck about 3 hours per day to recharge the battery pack, mostly coinciding with running the steam boiler two-three times per day.



I have a transfer switch in the basement that all three are connected too, made it easy and safe.



It worked great! Hope all forum members in Sandy's path are safe and OK.

jim_14

i have a 2004 Tahoe you think I can use an inverter

to start and run my boiler in the event of another long term power outage?



Im talking about putting in on in the morning and running it for an hour or so , then again at night.. Not an all day thing just strategic turn ons

jim_14

just to clarify

How many watts do I need to start my boiler? Its 105,000 btu, small 1 pipe steam.. Im looking for a simple inverter that plugs into my trucks cigarette lighter and that can just run the boiler safely

SWEI

How many Watts?

You'll have to measure to get an accurate number.

jim_14

I guess I can find that info on the boiler plate info?

Or with a meter?

SWEI

You need a meter

Easiest would be to borrow a clamp-on ammeter that can do a peak hold or inrush measurement.  This needs to be clamped over the black wire that feeds the boiler  (don't include the white or ground wires or you'll get nothing.)  Have any electrician friends?

jim_14

yes I do

I also have a clamp on ammeter still in the box, i dont know if it does a peak hold..

Im guessing the boiler wouldnt need a big inverter, as its the smallest burnham gas boiler they make (or the second smallest).. The only other variable is the taco circulating pump for the basement hot water thats tapped off the boiler. But worst case is I wouldnt run the circ. pump at the same time as the steam is being made

SWEI

measure both

With and without the pump running.

jim_14

ok will do

hopefully this will never need to be implemented.. But now i got another project... A kill switch to cut off the hot and nuetral coming in, and a male plug to be used for an alternate source of power..Time to draw it up!