Anyone using polypropylene pipe--Aquatherm eg?

Noman

Claims are that it doesn't expand/contract like PEX, takes temperature and pressure, and it's cheaper and easier than copper. We've used socket fusion for geothermal (polyethylene not polypropylene) and I'm just wondering if it makes sense to tool up for this stuff as well so we can use it for near-boiler piping etc.



Thanks!

SWEI

Aquatherm

I've become a huge fan, particularly for sizes above 1" nominal.  Below that, we usually transition to PEX (typically with a Webstone ball drain threaded onto a male NPT saddle fitting.)



The tooling costs a few bucks, but you can usually borrow or rent from your rep or supplier to get started.  The savings in both material cost and labor over copper are quite significant.  Those welded saddle fittings are the cat's meow for boiler rooms, pumps, and gauges and the stuff is so inert you can run methanol or acetone through it.  It doesn't droop like PEX and the thermal expansion is kept in check by the glass fiber layer in both Climatherm and the hotwater version of Greenpipe.  If you're hanging hot water pipes they do need a bit more frequent support than metal pipe -- about 40% if I had to guess, versus what, 5x as much for PEX?  You'll save on insulation as well, and if you're running chilled water there are very few condensation issues.



Aquatherm makes a number of different types of piping.  The ones with lower expansion rates (SDR 7.4 Greenpipe and SDR11 Climatherm) suitable for heating are co-extruded with glass fiber reinforcement making them quite different from other PP piping systems typically seen in industrial applications.  Lilac and SDR11 greenpipe are suitable for cold water only.  The socket fusion system is actually a DIN standard that applies to many manufacturers of both fittings and tools, but the saddle fittings (which really make the system IMO) and associated tooling are unique to Aquatherm.

Noman

Thanks, this is very helpful

Thanks for the helpful comments! I am surprised there isn't more discussion of it--sounds like a big improvement over copper.



best,

Norm

icesailor

Aquatherm:

I saw the stuff at the 2012 PHCC of MA Annual trade show in Marlboro and thought it was the next best thing. I talked up but it all fell on deaf ears. I hate that PEX hanging it, only to have it droop all over the place. I have a job where I want to use it and the drawback was the tool. That I can rent or borrow it sound good. I'll be looking into it.

Thanks for bringing it up.

SWEI

If you were closer

I could show you some nice jobs.  Ask your rep...



Above 1.25" or so the economics get pretty wonderful.  Transition fittings can really add up at those sizes so try to stay "in" the system as much as possible on larger diameters. I've worked out an alternative means of transitioning to PVC or CPVC on sizes 2" and up that beats theirs on both price and complexity.  Otherwise I use pretty much everything they make.



Speaking of diameters, they have their own friction loss charts which you should take advantage of when designing.  I've found that their SDR11 frequently allows one nominal size reduction when used in place of (SDR9) PEX.