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DE-Knuckleheading, Upgrading & Converting a Slant/Fin Liberty

Steamhead
Steamhead Member Posts: 15,350
Just finished this one- an L-30 steamer where whoever put it in, didn't bother to read the instructions. This time they used a bell reducer to knucklehead the pipe down from 3-inch to 2-inch instead of a bushing. And the copper had a failed joint that leaked all over the brand-new chimney connector.



We got the bell reducer off with some serious heat and torque.
All Steamed Up, Inc.
Towson, MD, USA
Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
Oil & Gas Burner Service
Consulting

Comments

  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 15,350
    Now we have a REAL header!

    3-inch header and 2-inch takeoffs, all in black steel. Somewhere up there, a Dead Man is smiling.
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Towson, MD, USA
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 15,350
    edited May 2012
    Now the Upgrade and Conversion

    The owner was tired of the high oil bills, so he had a gas line run, anticipating the conversion. We would have run it in black pipe rather than WardFlex, but there it is.



    We found the usual slipshod maintenance that we deplore. It was "serviced" every year but hadn't seen a vacuum in a long while. The vertical passes were about 70% blocked with hard white deposits. No wonder it guzzled oil.
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Towson, MD, USA
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 15,350
    New EZ-Gas and Probe LWCO

    completed the job. Gordo did his usual Kendorf strut wizardry.



    The oil tank was under the porch and was quite rusty. Good thing we had it removed when we did.



    it will be interesting to see how this system does in the 2012-13 heating season.
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Towson, MD, USA
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • gerry gill
    gerry gill Member Posts: 3,034
    Nice save!

    That ought to save them alot of dough this up coming season..that is if we have a winter this year..
    gwgillplumbingandheating.com
    Serving Cleveland's eastern suburbs from Cleveland Heights down to Cuyahoga Falls.

  • icesailor
    icesailor Member Posts: 7,265
    Nipples:

    And you did it all with stock, off the shelf nipples and fittings.

    Go figure.

    Those that know and do it right, never get a chance to do a nice job like that. Usually, the customer just lives with it or finds another "slug" to try and fix it.

    Your work is impeccable. 
  • billtwocase
    billtwocase Member Posts: 2,385
    your usual quality work Frank

    I wouldn't have spent much time on that particular boiler though. I would take a Peerless JO over one of those any day. Definite lack of, or poor maintenance here, but gotta say they are not a pleasure to clean and set. Great job, and the conversion will make a difference for sure
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 15,350
    As long as they're set up and maintained properly

    they're not bad. The biggest problem I find is when some idiot doesn't read the nozzle spec and uses a solid nozzle rather than a hollow or semi. This can plug a Liberty or Intrepid in about two days.



    But I like 3-pass boilers better, as most of us do, for their easier servicing. On gas the problem goes away.



    The castings in this boiler appear to be quite durable. I encountered one years ago that had been dry-fired, but it hadn't cracked. It did vaporize the coil plate gasket, but that was an easy repair. The newer Intrepid uses the same basic block castings, with a swing-out door added.



    Thanks, Bill, Gerry and Icy!
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Towson, MD, USA
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • billtwocase
    billtwocase Member Posts: 2,385
    just for the record

    late 80's was my last JO/JOT install. Between their weight, size, and cast leaks at that time, I started using WB models. The Slant Fin, around here anyway, came thru with Carlin. Bad combo. I like Pensotti as of now, but try to keep it American when I can. I bet that EZ gas works the best on those.
  • Hap_Hazzard
    Hap_Hazzard Member Posts: 2,756
    Uh-oh

    I'm embarrassed to admit that I don't know what's wrong with using a reducing coupler in a situation like that. I don't think I'd be tempted to reduce a 3" riser to 2" in the first place, but I'm at a loss as far as why it would be better to do it with a bushing. (Maybe the reducing coupler's shape helps to guide more water droplets up the riser?)



    The more I learn about this stuff the more I appreciate your consummate craftsmanship. Your skill, knowledge, and commitment to excellence are inspirational.
    Just another DIYer | King of Prussia, PA
    1983(?) Peerless G-561-W-S | 3" drop header, CG400-1090, VXT-24
  • billtwocase
    billtwocase Member Posts: 2,385
    that looks to be

    a straight coupling Hap. Those nipples don't come out of those boilers too easily, and to continue on with 3", that's how I would do it.  Frank would only pipe it as it should be
  • Mark N
    Mark N Member Posts: 1,094
    Reducer

    Hap



    when you use a reducer you decrease the size of the riser out of the boiler and therefore increase the velocity of the steam in the riser. This will caused more water to be sucked up out of the boiler into the header.
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 15,350
    Right

    and we usually see this type of knuckleheading done with bushings, which are more difficult to remove than bell reducers. 
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Towson, MD, USA
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • Hap_Hazzard
    Hap_Hazzard Member Posts: 2,756
    Right

    I get that it's not good to reduce the size of the riser. My confusion was about why it would have been any better to have done it with a bushing. I completely missed the irony in his statement. Now I feel really dumb.
    Just another DIYer | King of Prussia, PA
    1983(?) Peerless G-561-W-S | 3" drop header, CG400-1090, VXT-24
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 15,350
    I edited the original post

    to make it clearer without losing the irony- try it now.
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Towson, MD, USA
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • Hap_Hazzard
    Hap_Hazzard Member Posts: 2,756
    edited May 2012
    You didn't have to do that.

    It was my fault. I was too focused on admiring your iron work to appreciate your irony work. One-track mind, y'know. Easily derailed. :-)



    By the way, did you re-use that 2" union, or is that a new one?
    Just another DIYer | King of Prussia, PA
    1983(?) Peerless G-561-W-S | 3" drop header, CG400-1090, VXT-24
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 15,350
    It's a new one

    that got a bit wet.
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Towson, MD, USA
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • Gordo
    Gordo Member Posts: 797
    edited June 2012
    Thank You for Your Kind Words, Ice

    I always enjoy reading your "tell-it-like-it-is" comments!  They are a tonic for the soul.



    You're right.  A lot of  folks who get steam boilers installed by "others" and then call us later to fix them are shocked and angered to find out what it really costs to redo it correctly.   We all too often get the bum's rush out the door.



    In one sense, we failed those folks by not being able to convince them it was worth it to hire us to get their steam boilers installed properly.



    In another sense, they failed themselves by allowing the laws of economics to trump the laws of physics.



    We are not the Red Cross.  There is no church steeple over our office.  We are a for-profit corporation.  This is how we put the bread on our tables and feed our families. 



    Only the few who have allowed us to do our work properly are posted herein for you to admire. 



    The rest is silence.
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    "Reducing our country's energy consumption, one system at a time"
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Baltimore, MD (USA) and consulting anywhere.
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/all-steamed-up-inc
  • Gordo
    Gordo Member Posts: 797
    edited June 2012
    Thank You for Your Kind Words, Ice

    double post











    .
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    "Reducing our country's energy consumption, one system at a time"
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Baltimore, MD (USA) and consulting anywhere.
    https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/all-steamed-up-inc
This discussion has been closed.