Help me control the temperature in apartment - pics of challenging radiator setup included

jkozlow3

If you look at the attached pic of my radiator in my living room, you'll see that I don't have a lot of clearance around the vent.  I just put a new maid-o-mist size C vent on it the other day (possibly too large for my small radiator, although I'm on the 3rd floor).  I don't think I can fit ANYTHING larger than that on the radiator.  In fact, there is so little clearance that the maid-o-mist vent brushes against the wall as I turn it to tighten!



I'm looking for a setup that would allow me to better control the temperature in my room however.  Due to clearance issues, I don't think I can even fit something like a Hoffman 1A or Vent-Rite #1 on there at the moment as I wouldn't be able to screw them in without hitting the wall.



Can I add some kind of threaded 1/8" pipe elbow extension to get the vent out and away from the wall?  I would probably need a few bends in order to raise the vent a few inches above and then a few inches in front of the radiator to gain more clearance to install a larger vent or a TRV.  I'm assuming that re-routing the vent may have some consequences however?



I'm just wondering what you guys thing my best bet is for temperature control and if there is any way I can add a TRV or adjustable vent to this setup with minimal modification (no plumber).  This is an apartment that I rent and I really don't want to spend a fortune.



My cheapest option is probably getting the maid-o-mist model which comes with all the interchangeable orifices and do a lot of experimentation and put smaller orifices on the vent if it gets too hot in the room.  I realize this isn't an ideal solution for temperature control, so I wanted to know if I had any better options.



I really appreciate any thoughts you can offer.  Thanks in advance!



By the way, there is a 2nd identical radiator about 5 feet away, connected by a pipe that exits radiator #1 and runs behind the wood moulding you see in this pic.

Rod

Remote the radiator Vent

Hi - Since you are having a problem with getting enough space for the radiator vent just use a 90 degree street elbow and some piping and fittings to move the vent or TRV to a place where you have room to put it.  The only consideration is the vent needs to be oriented in the normal proper plane for a vent and that the piping have a slight slope so that any water than gets in the pipe, will drain back top the radiator.  If you use a TRV make sure the the TRV is sampling the heat of the room and not the heat near the radiator. ( example - Don't locate the TRV above the radiator where the rising heat from the radiator would affect it and give a false reading)  The piping setup to the radiators is pretty "mickey mouse" but as long as it works it's fine.

- Rod

Jean-David Beyer

Remote sensor?

I am not a professional, but I seem to recall seeing TRVs with remote sensors. The sensor connects to the actuator with a thin capillary tube. If you get one like that, you could locate the vent actuator wherever it is most practical (perhaps just above that radiator), and locate the sensor out of the way of the radiator, hot or cold windows, etc.

BobC

Slope?

It might just be me but does that piping from the radiator shut off valve to the radiator slope down? there has to be some slope from the radiator back to the valve so condensing steam can find it's way back to the boiler and not block incoming steam.



Since that radiator directly feeds another I'm not quite sure what effect a TRV would have on it, i suspect it would not stop that radiator from at least partially heating and might not be enough. Could you put a Maid O Mist #4 air valve on that radiator and if that is not enough do the same with the second radiator. Then try a TRV on the second radiator if the two smaller vents don't do the trick?



Maybe I'm over thinking this, if your getting way to much heat just replace the vent on this radiator with a 1/8" plug and see how that works out.



Bob

jkozlow3

...

I'm not sure if the pipe slopes downward toward the radiator or not.  It looks roughly level, but it's too short to get even a small level on it.



The point about the 2nd radiator on the same pipe negating the use of a TRV is interesting.  I was wondering that myself, as I think hot steam still gets to rad #2.



Assuming I wanted to try to add a longer, adjustable vent like a Vent-Rite #1 or Hoffman 1A, does it matter if my vent is say, 3-4 inches above the radiator

and 3-4 inches in front of it so long as it sits straight up?  I imagine I would need quite a few bends to get the vent above and out

in front of the radiator (see sketch attached).  Can I even assemble

something like what I've got in the sketch just by buying off the shelf

parts that screw together?  I have no plumbing experience.



I can always pick up some different maid-o-mist orifices since that wouldn't require any changes to the piping at all, sure.  That was my first thought, but I was just wondering if there was a better way of controlling the temp in my setup.  It's not always hot in my apartment.  This past weekend (freak NYC snow storm and cold temps), it was a couple degrees colder (69-70ish) than I'd prefer it to be in my apartment (72-73 ideally).  Today it was in the mid 50s outside and my apartment got up to 77-78 at one point because the radiators were still running.  That's what prompted me to start thinking about a solution I'd have a little more control over.



Thanks again!

MrDvorak

Vertical vent

That vent setup in your picture looks too complicated to my untrained eye. Have you though of a vertical vent? It would screw directly into the first elbow.

David Nadle

Ideas

I wonder if you could achieve what you want by plugging the vent on radiator #1 and putting a TRV and a fast vent on radiator # 2. You could turn the vent on #1 upside down for a few days as an experiment, or remove it and install a 1/8" plug.

jkozlow3

Interesting

Interesting thought.  So the 2 radiators (5 feet apart) would just act like 1 long radiator then if I plugged radiator #1 and put a TRV on radiator #2?  Right now, radiator #2 gets warm after radiator #1 since it gets it's steam from the outlet of radiator #1.  I assume this approach would cause them to both get warm at about the same time?



Does anyone else have any thoughts/opinions on this approach?  I actually have enough clearance for a TRV on radiator #2 providing I can screw the vent into the top after the TRV valve has already been connected.

jkozlow3

Update

So I turned the vent on rad #1 upside down and both radiators (connected by a pipe out of rad #1) act as 1 radiator.  So I believe I can put a TRV on radiator #2 since I think I have *just* enough clearance according to Macon and Danfoss spec sheets.  I think I'm going to give this a try since my room is getting to hot the past couple of days.  The radiators are still heating up regularly despite outside temps in the mid-50s and an inside temp of about 76-77.



Dumb question, but where do I get a 1/8" plug to plug off rad #1?  Can I pick this up at Home Depot?  I searched for one at pexsupply.com, but didn't see one.



Thanks again!

David Nadle

HD should have it

Pex supply has it too: http://www.pexsupply.com/Jinan-J-BLP-01-1-8-Black-Plug

If you have clearance issues you should look into the Danfoss remote dial/sensor model. You can mount the dial where it will get an unobstructed sense of the room temperature. You'll also need a straight vent instead of a 90° vent. 

jkozlow3

Thanks

Thanks.  Don't know why I didn't see that plug on the Pex site.



Yeah, I think I'm going to get the Danfoss unit + valve mounted dial w/remote sensor (6ft).  On radiator #2 I should have enough clearance to install the valve mounted dial, as I have about 6.25" in total length between the radiator and the wall.  Since my radiators are flush against the wall in a recessed area under the window (see pic in post #1), I'll definitely need a remote senor since airflow is restricted around the radiator.



Does anyone know the venting capability/capacity of the Danfoss straight vent?  I'm wondering if I should go with their vent or another straight vent like a Gorton?