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Stumper

I'm working on a system which I think was originally a Marsh design, 2-pipe vapor. It's been "tweaked" into being a combination 2 pipe <em>and</em> 1 pipe system, with some predictable water hammer issues. There is a component in the piping that I have never seen before-I'm thinking it's a type of return/differential trap, but I can't find it in any of my literature, so I'm really not sure.

Anybody seen this before?

Comments

  • will smith_4
    will smith_4 Member Posts: 259
    whoops

    Rotate image to the left...
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 16,723
    edited September 2011
    That's a new one on me

    is there a name on it? Do any of the system's original hardware- valves, traps etc- have names on them? How does it connect to the system?



    I'm thinking it might be an old mercury-pot air seal, as used on the original Trane, Morgan and K.M.C. systems to form a vacuum. If it was a Morgan, the air went up a riser to the second story and back down to the mercury pot.



    Where is it located?
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Towson, MD, USA
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • moneypitfeeder
    moneypitfeeder Member Posts: 249
    That's not "my" Marsh!

    Hello, I have a 2 pipe Marsh vapor system with a 1 pipe rad  in the attic. That my friend doesn't look like the Marsh systems I have seen, but it's really intriguing! Can you get a photo of the bell end of it? And are there any discernible marking on it or are they covered by too much paint?Lastly can you provide a little info as to where this is piped into? Its hard to tell what we are looking at is it going from a really small main to a dry return, that has a silver air vent piped into it? Dee
    steam newbie
  • will smith_4
    will smith_4 Member Posts: 259
    Name that DooHickey

    I couldn't find any stamping at all on that device, but it does look like it has been painted over a few dozen times. It's physically located at the end of two returns-if you look all the way up, you can see a main vent to the right, and a plug on the left. I don't know which is supposed to be there-I do know that when I cycle the boiler, I can hear condensate at this point just hanging out. I'm going to call my customer later this morning to see if I can go over and hit that thing with a wire wheel/grinder  to see if I can find some info on it.

    I just hope that there aren't other doohickeys that used to be in the piping that have been removed because someone else didn't know what they were there for- and therefor didn't matter...

    On the plus side, I've gotta say that having Steamhead stumped along with me me makes me feel a little better-I'll get more pics.

    All the Best-

    Will
  • JStar
    JStar Member Posts: 2,752
    My guess.

    Return trap.



    Where does that pipe with the vent go? To the boiler? Does it pick up any other piping?
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 16,723
    Wouldn't be the first time

    that's what I like about this business- we're always finding something we haven't seen before.



    What part of the country is this system located in?
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Towson, MD, USA
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • will smith_4
    will smith_4 Member Posts: 259
    Stumper

    We're in the suburbs of Chicago with this system. The line with the main vent drops right into the wet return.
  • With that system.....

    I'd expect your either up north on the coast, over in Oak Park, South In Blue Island, or way out along the Fox River.   Not too many burbs old enough to have a system like that.
    The Steam Whisperer (Formerly Boilerpro)

    Chicago's Steam Heating Expert





    Noisy Radiators are a Cry for Help
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 16,723
    And

    you've just found the one you want to look at it- Boilerpro!
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Towson, MD, USA
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • will smith_4
    will smith_4 Member Posts: 259
    I'm guessing you're from around here

    The house is in River Forest. We're heading back out next week to go through the system as a whole-there are water hammer issues in various areas of the home. We can already see some obvious problems- some radiators have been re-piped in copper tubing with clearly visible sags for example. There are also 1-pipe rads out there,(in addition to the 2-pipe with traps) so I'm really curious as to the original type of system this was. I've been wondering if it might have been a 2-pipe with air vents that has been "upgraded" at some point with traps.

    Thanks for your thoughts on this one folks!
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 16,723
    Those merc pots were also used

    on one-pipe systems with air-lines- think Paul system without the ejector. Check out chapter 15 of Lost Art- they're in there. 
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Towson, MD, USA
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
This discussion has been closed.