Installing fin tube baseboard in bay window

Fred Rappuhn

I have to install fin tube baseboard in a bay window, each section is approx. 2 1/2'.

What would be the best way, purchase (3)  3' sections and cut down or a longer section into the pieces I need.



And what is the best way to cut the covers/dampers?

icesailor

Fin Tube in a bay window:

The best way is to but three foot sections. Slant fin makes a 2.5 piece. The reason that it is better to but three pieces is that it is priced per foot and you will pay the same. But, you need two brackets for each piece and you only get 4 on an 8' element. So you must buy extra brackets.

Brad White

A Nice Thing To Do

Bay windows typically have more framing and glass than any square footage in your house and less usable length to install fin tube.



What I have done in the past is to create a wood enclosure, hardwood plywood usually, as high as and topped with an extended sill. Atop the inner width of this sill, let in a stamped metal grille of your choosing. 



The inner width/depth is just enough to clear the supported elements and to limit bypass around them.



The bottom has an open toe space. Basically what you are creating is a tall chimney finished to blend with surrounding woodwork and enclosing the elements.



The fin tube elements in turn are mounted to the wall and stacked at least three elements high, overlapped so that the wall has full coverage. (Two foot elements seem to work well in most bays.)



Keep in mind that doubling the element will NOT double the output. The first element will give 100% and the second, seeing warmer entering air and a lower delta-T, will give about a third to half. A top element will add another 20 percent or so. You are on your own regarding certified ratings, but hey.  Besides, the taller enclosure gives you higher output because of the chimney effect.



A  few tips:

1. Supply water always enters the top element and returns out the bottom to assure counter-flow so that the leaving air sees the highest temperature water for a good send-off.



2. When you supply in one end, go back and forth, serpentine style. This gives the radiation very even temperatures, the same average water temperature no matter where you draw a vertical line.



3. Stagger the elements for coverage as noted but also any gaps not stacked, (say the second tier without a first tier portion below it) allows you to get 100 percent out of that element.



4. To turn the corners, those odd angles if not 45 degrees, use a street 45 and standard 45 el. Try a dry fit and rotate them, you will see that you can pretty much make any angle you like. We call this a "knuckle joint". Good for aligning around odd degree corners.

icesailor

Cutting baseboard:

The above method of "stacking" may work. I've never needed to do that. I thought you were asking how to install through a bay window that is framed to the floor. And you needed to run across a wall that held the bay window. For what it is worth, I run the back pieces to the corners on the outside corners. On the inside corners, I space the back pieces away from the corners so that the front pieces will meet and not run by. The inside and outside corners are what they are. Not perfect but better than nothing.

As far as cutting the enclosures, I use a reciprocating saw like a Bosch type Saber Say with a metal cutting blade. I have taped Duct Tape to the shoe of the saw so as not to scratch the enclosure. My supplier and others sell a 3/4" copper corrugated  flexible connector to bend around corners.

As far as the corners, the 2-45's trick is OK. I find it cumbersome. I've annealed 45's and with the tube in it, been able to bend it to fit when it is soft. Just make sure you clean it well before soldering it.

Fred Rappuhn

You answered my question.

Yes, I am running through a bay window that is framed to the floor. I only need 6,500 BTU for the room, (slan fin heat loss) so I will have plenty of wall space, no need or room to stack under the window.



I did plan on using the sawsall with a nice blade.



What line of Slant fin is the better grade, (this is for my own home), ?



I will be using running the return back over top of the fin tube, so less work in the corners would be better.

Big Ed_4

Series

Series 80 uses a heaver gauge enclosure then Series 30 , it will resist the dents and bends ... Do you have kids ?

icesailor

Cutting Baseboard:

I don't use a Sawzall to cut the baseboard, I use a Saber Saw or some call a "Jig Saw. A Sawzall is difficult to control. A Saber Saw isn't.

I usually use #30 Slant Fin. #15 isn't bad. it's lower but you need more of it. #80 is very heavy and rugged and has a higher output. It's also a lot higher than the #15.

Fred Rappuhn

Got it!!

I was planning on the slant Fin 30, with price out the 80 to compare.



This will go in my 15 yr old son room., I think he is done ramming his toys into the walls, I hope!!



Have a saber saw, will use that,



Thanks all for you input!!!

icesailor

Got It:

Fred,

Slant/Fin makes three models of baseboard. #15 which has a lower output and height, #30 which has a higher output and is higher in height, and #80 which has the highest height, is a thicker metal and highest output. I always run into people not wanting baseboard because they don't like the looks and other lame reasons. I recently did a rehab where I removed CI radiators and installed baseboard. They had very high baseboard/mopboards and I was able to use #15 because its height did not come up to the molding on top of the baseboard. #30 would have. Cutting the baseboard was not an option.

Fred Rappuhn

Pretty much same here.

I am removing some CI rads in the upstairs, (bedroom) of our house. Tall mop boards, after I check on the size/specs. of the baseboard, I will determine if I cut out the mop board or install in front of the mop board. I don't want the baseboard to protrude to far into the room to get kicked/beat up.  Kinda leaning towards the 30 series baseboards.



These mop boards are just painted so I will have baseboards blended in more so.

Plan on a better placement of the radiation, (ext. wall & under windows), some of the old CI rads are placed on interior walls and really interfered with room layout.



All CI rads are not matching, plan to install the matching rads downstairs in the living area based on output,ect....  after I get sandblasted and painted/coated



Upstairs zone will be all fin tube and down stairs will be CI, all home runs to manifold after re piping



Thanks,

icesailor

Baseboard:

I cut out the baseboard if it works for me. Sometimes in a really old house, where the baseboard is high and unusual, I put the heaters on the baseboards. From what you are describing on the second floor, I usually try to connect two rooms through a wall. That way, I only have two drops, one supply and one return. I loop over the baseboard elements to get back. With finesse, you can do the whole second floor with a couple of sets risers. To go through a wall, use a long 1/4" feeler bit and drill the carefully marked holes through the wall. Then, use a hole saw with the long feeler bit in place of the regular one on the hole say. I usually drill at least a 1 1/2" hole. The first hole will guide you through the the holes with the big bit. Don't cut out the baseboards. Drill them out doing the above. Cut out the end cap so it fits over the pipes. It makes a clean install.