The future of hydronics.

N2HOTH2O

The future of hydronics and solar thermal is in commercial applications. Hydronics does offer a very comfortable way to heat a home. However, when the consumer is faced with a choice of a hot water heat only system and then the prospect of adding on an A/C system for an additional cost most customers will opt for the all in one package of A/C and heat in forced air system and forget about the hydronic system.

The same is true of the solar water heating customer that currently heats their water with natural gas. This customer will forget about the solar water heating system the minute they discover that it will take about 15 years to payoff the solar water heating system even with all of the great rebates, tax breaks and incentives. Natural gas low cost per therm to heat water is very tough to compete with on a residential scale.

However, on a commercial scale solar hot water can be used to feed a boiler thus allowing for less use of natural gas, oil, or electricity to heat the water to process or heating temperatures.

I guess the old adage is true. As one door closes another opens. Except in this case one market is shrinking and another very large market is opening.

rlaggren

Residential ROI depends on the climate

And fuel costs. Lots of cold climate around and fuel costs are rising fast. Also a comfort factor when the hydronic is properly installed.



Solar DHW similar - payback time depends on usage and fuel. If installed when the home is built, the initial cost is also less than on retrofits.



So yeah, what you say is sort of true, but... It depends.



Rufus

SpeyFitter

Ductless

I think ductless systems for A/C may be an ally that you can use as a residential hydronic heating contractor to get rid of ducts all together (with the exception of perhaps an HRV and/or bathroom fans for ventiliation) and still provide cooling. Yes more cost combined, but there are ways to sell it...

Also, selling more than just radiant floors as the heat emitter. How about panel radiators as a low temp solution or other radiant surfaces as Mark E has suggested in the past.

Dave Yates (GrandPAH)

hybrid

The Future of Hydronics will be whatever you (we) make it! Personally, I've seen a shift towards hybrid systems that incorporate hydronics for both commercial and residential. The glass is more than half-full.  

Mark Eatherton

Sleeping Giants...

I think that the North American contractor is in the driver seat here, and if they choose to take a left where they should have taken a right, that is THEIR problem.



The intelligent "Comfort" contractor that specializes in delivering comfort AND health AND efficiency is going to be on top of the program.



If you don't deal with sheet metal, I'd recommend you form an alliance with a company that does, and use them as a sub contractor to deliver the whole shebang. Personally, if I even LOOK at sheet metal, my hand start bleeding automatically. My sheet metal contractor friends have it down pat, and wear really thick leather gloves to avoid bleeding to death.



The good ol' days of US (hydronics) versus THEM (forced error heating) are long past and behind us. Witness the RPA's annual conference this year will be merged with the ACCA / IAQA Indoor Air Expo, February 15-17, 2011 in San Antonio, Texas. If you chose to consider them the enemy, then YOU will lose customers. If you merge your operations and utilize their cooling services, then you both win, and you get a percentage of the money they would have taken right out of your mouth.



Heating comfort, we have down pat. MRT drives the bus of human comfort, and hydronic radiant is the king of controlling MRT. Now, we need to focus on COOLING comfort, which in most cases requires the movement of air in order to deliver full spectrum cooling comfort. If you design the system around a radiant cooling ceiling system, then you have covered two bases with one hit. The latent part of cooling installation costs will be significantly less if the sensible is being handled with the hydronic component, and my gut tells me that the overall cost will be less doing it this way, versus doing RFH and a completely separate stand alone forced air cooling system. Tie IAQ in with a smallish HRV, and you have pretty much covered ALL the bases with one team.



As it pertains to efficiency and solar, I think our government and people in general are too enamored with PV, wind and other sexy but technically unreliable renewable resources. They are overlooking the potential of Solar Thermal, which is 60% efficient versus PV at 20% efficient, and not much improvement on the horizon. Solar thermal is directly compatible with known means of providing radiant comfort, and has been and always will be on the top of the heap as it pertains to alternative energy. That, coupled with latent solar (GSHP) technology, again puts the intelligent contractor in a position to continue providing comfort, while expanding their horizons to include health, efficiency and alternative energy in their all important portfolios.



The future is in our hands. Treat it correctly, by diversifying, and the horizon looks bright and shiny. Ignore it, and like a red headed step child with freckles, it will go away... The decision is ours. Lead follow or get out of the way!



HNY!



ME

meplumber

Climate is the key.

Rufus made a great point.  Up here in Maine, with a design temp of -10 or more, scorched hot air is uncomfortable on its best day and not enough for the rest.



I am seeing a lot of interest from both residential and commercial customers in radiant with ductless mini splits.  Also doing a lot of panel rads.



Hydronics isn't dead residentially at all.  I pull out hot air furnaces weekly and put in hydronic because the customers are tired of being uncomfortable.