Trying to keep a 3rd Fl warm

Dudz

Hi, I have a 3 Story 100yr old Victorian house heated by a steam boiler fueled with oil. My programable stat is on the first floor and trying to keep the 3rd floor at least 65 degrees min without keeping the first floor @ 80 is a challenge. I have new windows and insulation in the attic. I just learned how to set my stat to cycle twice an hr, that was the minimum for my brand. Any suggestions??

Rod

Radiator Vents

Hi-  What make and model are your radiator vents? Radiator vents are available in different sized venting capacity. Some have adjustable capacity. You might try a larger vent on your attic radiators and slow down the venting (smaller vent capacity)  on the hot downstairs radiators. I have an old 3 story house and had the same problems. I'm assuming your system is single pipe steam.

- Rod

Dudz

Trying to keep my 3rd fl warm

My system is a true 2 pipe system, and by the way the radiators on the 3rd fl are taller and wider than the ones on the 1st and 2nd flrs.

Rod

2 pipe system

Okay, since it's two pipe, forget the vent advice! You're lucky having a 2 pipe as most houses that old (like mine) are 1 pipe.  Do you have traps on your radiators?

Dudz

Trying to keep my 3rd Fl warm

I believe the fitting on the return part of the radiators are traps. They are large cone type fittings. The feed end is an on/ off vavle. All the radiators heats up fine.

Rod

2 Pipe steam system

Hi- You mentioned that all the radiators are heating fine but it stays cold (65 degrees) on the third floor but hot (80 degrees on the 1st floor. Do the radiators all get hot at the same time? Do they get hot all the way across? I'm mainly interested in comparing a 1st floor radiator to one of about the same size on the third floor. Is there a lot of time difference from when steam enters the 1st floor radiators and the 3rd floor radiators?



 Where are the main vents located? What is the maximum steam pressure on the gauge

\when the burner shuts off?



One of the advantages of a two pipe steam system is that you can throttle down the steam entering the radiators by just partially opening the inlet valves on the radiators.

Have you tried partially opening the inlet valves on the hot radiators and fully opening the inlet valves on the third floor radiators?

- Rod

Dudz

Trying to keep my 3rd fl warm

I'll provide those details soon, meanwhile the basic problem is although all floors heat up relatively at the same time, but once the stat on the first floor reaches a set temp,the third floor cools faster while stat maintains the same temp on the first fl, the third fl rads are not being heated long enough to maintain the same temp on the 3rd floor. That's were the 80 degrees comes to play. If I set the stat for 80 degrees everywhere is 80 at first but then the third floor cools ,and even while the boiler maintains 80 on the first floor but the third floor continues to cool.

Patrick_North

15 degrees?

Hmm. First off, I"m not a professional. But I also own a three story Victorian and had similar issues when we first moved in.

IF, as you say all radiators are getting steam at roughly the same time AND IF all radiators heat all the way across, AND IF the total radiaton on each floor roughly matches heatloss (or is at least proportionately equal) and there's still a 15 degree differential in the second and third floor temps, then I'd bet dollars to donuts that you have problems with insulation and or infiltration.

How do you know you have adequate and properly installed insulation? We had similar issues until we insulated the beejeezus out of our old gray beast. Now temps on all three floors are dead even.

Good luck,

Patrick

Rod

3rd Floor

Don't bother with answering the questions as your replies would seem to indicate your steam system is functioning properly.  While there are ways one could "tweek" the system  to get better heat on your third floor, they would be a serious detriment to your fuel economy.

I agree with Patrick. I'd find out where all the heat is going.  In the long run insulation is much cheaper than fuel. It might pay to have someone do a check of your insulation with an IR camera. IR pictures save a lot of guessing. I've attached an IR picture and you can see while there is reasonable insulation on the walls, there is a big heat leak just under the eves. Note - You can see where the hot water /steam piping goes from the first to second floor inside the wall.

- Rod

Dudz

Thanks Guys

I'm running some test now, but it does seem to come down to insulation issues,and since my 3 story Victorian House is actually 2 stories of large stones 8in thick then layers of brick attached interiorly with5/8 plastered walls,the R factor must be quite low..The 3rd floor rooms are actually built under the 15ft peaked slate roof, so yes, insulation could very well be the issue here.I'll have a professional investigate the heat loss..Thank you so much. 

jpf321

did you guys know ..

The R-Value of brick is a abhorrent .. check out the R-Value of common building materials here: http://www.coloradoenergy.org/procorner/stuff/r-values.htm



I used to think I was lucky to live in a truly 12" double brick house .. I might as well be living in a paper bag .. but at least brick is pretty low with regards to infiltration .. however, one the air currents in the space between the interior brick and the plaster, heat loss through convection a plenty ..



that's why I took it upon myself to blow insulation into 1 room last week (yes last week was busy, insulation project on monday and boiler on thurs) .. we (well my wife watched) started with 1 room to see how well I could do it .. drill the holes, blow the cellulose, patch the holes, paint the patches .. and all the while maintain cleanliness for my 3yr to sleep there everynight like nothing was occuring .. (she also decided that my patched holes full of "white playdoh" we a great place to stick her little fingers .. ) so the patching part is what I'm upto.. i thought I was done, but it didn't pass the wife's inspection ..



I guess the point to this is that my daughter's room is actually MUCH less lossy .. my bedroom is next .. eh .. maybe next week.