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Please help me figure out radiator EDR

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Mark_125
Mark_125 Member Posts: 56
Hello Steam Experts,

I'm trying to get a head start on my heating system early this year. Last winter I had my main vents upgraded, pipes insulated, thermostat replaced and boiler serviced. This bought my gas bill for the winter down by about 10% and resulted in a much more responsive system (radiators start to warm after 12 minutes vs 90 with no insulation). This year I'm planning to get the venting on all my Radiators figured out. I have most of the charts and books from resources available here but a couple of things elude me.

1) when measuring the height of the radiator to determine EDR do I measure from the bottom of the legs to the top of the tubes or just the height of the tubes themselves.

2) My kitchen and bathroom have a different kind of radiator that I can't find any reference for. I've attached a photo, can somebody please help me figure out how I calculate EDR for them.

(Please forgive the state of that radiator, this house needs a lot of updating and we're getting to it soon)

Many thanks,

Mark

Comments

  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 16,949
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    That's a cast-iron cabinet-type radiator

    might have been made by Weil-McLain or Burnham. Measure the height, width and depth and we'll see what we can do. Also look for a name on it. 
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Towson, MD, USA
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • Mark_125
    Mark_125 Member Posts: 56
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    Radiator Sizes

    Here are the sizes of the two radiators:

    5" deep x 20" high x 31.5"wide

    5" deep x 20" high x 21.5" wide

    The larger one has BURNHAM written vertically in the left side. The smaller one is jammed in a very tight opening and I can't see anything written on it but they look very similar.

    Thanks,

    Mark
  • Steamhead
    Steamhead Member Posts: 16,949
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    The one in the picture

    has 14 sections, and each section is 2.25 square feet, so its EDR is 31.5.



    Count the sections on the other one, multiply by 2.25 and you'll have its EDR.
    All Steamed Up, Inc.
    Towson, MD, USA
    Steam, Vapor & Hot-Water Heating Specialists
    Oil & Gas Burner Service
    Consulting
  • jpf321
    jpf321 Member Posts: 1,568
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    an easier way...

    i've come to realize on these 20" x 5" cabinet "Sunrads"

    .. 1sq ft of EDR for each inch wide...



    therefore  31.5inches wide = 31.5 EDR = 2.25 x 14 sections. 
    1-pipe Homeowner - Queens, NYC

    NEW: SlantFin Intrepid TR-30 + Tankless + Riello 40-F5 @ 0.85gph | OLD: Fitzgibbons 402 boiler + Beckett "SR" Oil Gun @ 1.75gph

    installed: 0-20oz/si gauge | vaporstat | hour-meter | gortons on all rads | 1pc G#2 + 1pc G#1 on each of 2 mains

    Connected EDR load: 371 sf venting load: 2.95cfm vent capacity: 4.62cfm
    my NEW system pics | my OLD system pics
  • Mark_125
    Mark_125 Member Posts: 56
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    What about question 1?

    Thank you steamhead and jpf. Do you have any thoughts on question 1 from my original post?

    1) when measuring the height of the radiator to determine EDR do I measure from the bottom of the legs to the top of the tubes or just the height of the tubes themselves.

    Thanks again,

    Mark
  • nicholas bonham-carter
    nicholas bonham-carter Member Posts: 8,578
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    radiator venting

    if you are doing these edr calculations in order to figure out the venting, then just use the same existing size on all, and then if some are slow to heat up, pay attention to the main vents on that line or group, and increase it.

    remember that the radiator vents should only let the air out of the riser, plus the radiator. this volume is small in comparison to the combined total of the steam supply pipes, plus the boiler steam chest. if you have a radiator on the top of a 3-storey riser, then you can increase the capacity for that radiator, if it is slow to heat.--nbc
  • jpf321
    jpf321 Member Posts: 1,568
    Options
    from the legs

    always measure rads from the legs. 
    1-pipe Homeowner - Queens, NYC

    NEW: SlantFin Intrepid TR-30 + Tankless + Riello 40-F5 @ 0.85gph | OLD: Fitzgibbons 402 boiler + Beckett "SR" Oil Gun @ 1.75gph

    installed: 0-20oz/si gauge | vaporstat | hour-meter | gortons on all rads | 1pc G#2 + 1pc G#1 on each of 2 mains

    Connected EDR load: 371 sf venting load: 2.95cfm vent capacity: 4.62cfm
    my NEW system pics | my OLD system pics
  • jpf321
    jpf321 Member Posts: 1,568
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    burnham's radiant PDF is gone

    Burnham has replaced their "radiant_lit.pdf" with "radiant_spec.pdf" .. in doing so, they no longer provide the EDR for radiants. The PDF they have posted shows that it is Page 8 of a presumably longer document. Likely the EDR is on Page 9 ... I'm sure they thought they were doing the right thing.



    Alas I do not have a copy of the original PDF. Does anyone else have it?
    1-pipe Homeowner - Queens, NYC

    NEW: SlantFin Intrepid TR-30 + Tankless + Riello 40-F5 @ 0.85gph | OLD: Fitzgibbons 402 boiler + Beckett "SR" Oil Gun @ 1.75gph

    installed: 0-20oz/si gauge | vaporstat | hour-meter | gortons on all rads | 1pc G#2 + 1pc G#1 on each of 2 mains

    Connected EDR load: 371 sf venting load: 2.95cfm vent capacity: 4.62cfm
    my NEW system pics | my OLD system pics
  • jpf321
    jpf321 Member Posts: 1,568
    edited August 2010
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    Radiant EDR Document

    I called Burnham to alert them of their error .. they were kind enough to Scan the Full 8 Page document that they found in their drawer and email it over to me .. now THAT'S CUSTOMER SERVICE! Thanks Burnham!



    FYI, the gentleman said that he has a 130 page PDF document which contains all the obsoleted manuals ... I guess I should have had him send that to me as well. 



    EDIT: I called back and spoke with the same gentleman again to ask for the above 130pg doc ... he clarified that the doc is in his "obsolete" directory. And the doc in question is the Radiant Floor Planning and Install Doc (attached below) .. I have suggested to him and he is going to suggest, making a section on the website for all obsoleted documents.



    Dan -- perhaps you can archive the attached Burnham Rad document?
    1-pipe Homeowner - Queens, NYC

    NEW: SlantFin Intrepid TR-30 + Tankless + Riello 40-F5 @ 0.85gph | OLD: Fitzgibbons 402 boiler + Beckett "SR" Oil Gun @ 1.75gph

    installed: 0-20oz/si gauge | vaporstat | hour-meter | gortons on all rads | 1pc G#2 + 1pc G#1 on each of 2 mains

    Connected EDR load: 371 sf venting load: 2.95cfm vent capacity: 4.62cfm
    my NEW system pics | my OLD system pics
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