Any comments about Biasi boilers

Hey_Obie

Trying to decide on a boiler. Looking for comments on the Biasi. The price is good, it is a three pass boiler.



It appears that you have to assemble them which can be good or bad. The good is that it is easier to move into the basement. The bad is that it is not factory assembled.



Thanks

CMadatMe

Nice Little Boiler

The iron is together just have to slap the jacket on and mount the burner. Simple jacket install. Sold alot of Biasi. Looking at a B-10 or SG? Its a low mass boiler. Very little water content. Overall good boiler.

Hey_Obie

B10-5

I am between the Buderus and the Biasi. The Biasi is about $300 less but I assume the Buderus is better. Not sure since I don't work with them like you guys do.



I am looking at a B10-5 (and the Buderus G115WS5). Not sure what the SG is. Is it Gas? I am working with oil.



I think the low mass boiler is the trend. I have a pretty big single stage boiler with a hot water coil that has been running fine for probably 30 years. But I need to start saving on oil. I just added an indirect and am ready to swap out the big boy.

CMadatMe

SG Boiler

The SG is a more comparison to the Buderus. The B-10 and the SG are both oil and gas via using an oil burner or a power gas burner. The SG have more beef in control options from the factory. Have you looked at the Viessmann Vitorond 100 Series Oil Boiler from Viessmann?

Robert O'Brien

Nice boiler!

How did you size this? I've installed about 200 between both Buderus and Biasi and have never sold a 5 section 115 and only one 5 section Biasi.

CMadatMe

Nice Work!

Now that's a B-10 in action. Your right on the 115 generally see contractors go to the 215 after the G115-28 and that's alot of muscle that is probably not needed.

PS. For the THIRD TIME sending your service kit should be in Hicks.

Hey_Obie

Viessmann Vitorond 100 Series

I have tried to look at the Viessman before, but I could never find pricing or a place to purchase. Do you have a suggestion. I would like to take a closer look.

CMadatMe

Try This

Here's all the info you will need on the boiler itself. Where are you located? You can visit www.viessmann-us.com and locate the rep who can turn you on to a wholesaler in your area.



This link will give you info for the boiler itself.



http://www.vitoteam.com/Pages/eng/sub/submittal.php?b1=VR1-33&brn1=NX-VR133&x1=VR1&

Hey_Obie

Thanks Robert!

As far as sizing, I did it the lazy way. I called in a heating company and they gave me a recommendation of a Buderus G215/3. I thought the 215 was too large, so I dropped to the 115 series. They gave me a less expensive option of WM WTGO-4. Too big.



My current boiler is an HB Smith with a heating capacity of 170BTUH and and IBR of 150BTUH and a firing rate or 1.35 and an 8" flu. This is way to large.



I have just completed breaking my one zone (1 1/4 steel), venturi system into three zones plus a zone for domestic hot water (triangle tube). I have install a TACO ZVC406 zone valve control and a Wilo-strtus ECO variable speed circulator.



So it is time to replace the boiler. I know I need to size my system, but my house is so complex, I feel that I would never trust my figures.



The house was originally built in the 1800's with no insulation (what is the R value of wood siding covered with asbetos shingle covered with vinyl siding?). It has a cellar under 1/2 of it and uninsulated crawl spaces under the other half. I have put on an insulated addition and replaced all 25 windows



The house is about 3000 sq/ft. I live near the Maryland/PA border. I would love to get the smallest unit i could, but the fear of too small scares me. But too big is inefficient



From what you say, the G115WS is too large and I am with you, So I would have two options if I went Buderus (G115/WS3 and G115/WS4). do you think the G115WS/3 is too small? For a couple hundred $ more, I could do the G115WS/4. Which would you put in?



Thanks for your help and input.

shoudabeenaplumba

Just went through the same thing

I looked long and hard at the Biasi boilers.  Great because they are low mass, but in the end they just fit my system because of it.  My largest of 5 zones is about 30k btu with baseboard radiation, the smallest of which is 7k  I was afraid of the lack of mass, and figured I would need a buffer tank to avoid short-clycing.  I went for a well-insulated high mass boiler,simply because I got a deal.  I think the biasi coupled with a boiler buddy may have been more efficienct because I would have been able to isolate the boiler buddy during the Summer months. 

 Original boiler was Trinanco Heatmaker with tankless coil.  First Winter we burned 1600 gallons of oil.  Since then I've done some stuff and this last Winter we burned just under 1100 gallons.   I repiped all the circulators, added an indirect (WM, which is a rebranded TT) and replaced the boiler.  The original boiler was 164k btu/hr, but that was for a 2600 sqft house.  After two additions the house is 4300 sqft, the boiler was downfired to 1.0 gph. and on the coldest days of the year the old boiler ran for a maximum of 9hrs/day.  I did a heat loss calc, then another one, then another one, till finally I couldn't convince myself that I was screwing up with 75-90k btu/hr.  I'm in Southern NH.  Average house construction.  Even at a thumb rule of 30btu/sqft my original boiler was close to 3x size before the additions



My new boiler is 92k.    I've got plans for solar hot water, and have a wood stove insert that practially heats the house on the weekends.  I know I'm right on the line when it comes to sizing (because the traditional line is an error factor of close to 100%!)  but it the house dips down to 65F for a day or two in January when we don't run the insert then so what?  Better that then oversize for 353 days/yr. 

Hey_Obie

Become a plumba

Great story and sounds exactly like mine. I wish I knew last year what I know know this year. I would have loved to have known how many hours my furnace ran on the coldest days of the year. I don't think it even ran 8.



I want to drop to the sub 1.0GPH. The smallest Buderus (G115WS/3) is 85,000 Gross BTU and .70GPH. I can't believe that the smallest unit they make would fit my house. But I guess I need to go through the learning curve of doing a heat loss calculation.



All you smart guys on this board keep asking what the heat loss is. I guess I have to go through the pain. IS there free software to help with the heat calculation?



I have got to say, this whole project that I have been through has been very educational not to mention challenging. I can't tell you how many hours I have in reading and internet time and soldering and cutting and threading steel pipe. I have enjoyed every minute, but I have 10 times more effort and time into this than I would have ever estimated.



I haven't regretted a minute. Once I get the unit installed, I will work on outdoor reset and would like to add a radiant heat zone in my cold kitchen floor. Another 50 hours of learning and work

shoudabeenaplumba

Slant-Fin is a good heat loss (from what I hear)

I used it before they stopped giving away the download and came up with 95k btu/hr with a design temp of -10.  For my area its -7 for Concord NH, and I'm south of that.  It may get that cold at night, but I can't ever remember a sustained temp here below 0f for more than a few days. January is usually +10F give or take.  I also used a Solar web site which has a pretty detailed working.  I wasn't able to convince my plumber-in-law that it was that low, but the fuel bill doesn't lie, if anything its lower but I know that's because the wood stove is doing its job. 

 The final straw was this and one other website. At this point I must give thanks to all here and those real-life pros from whom I've mooched what I've struggled to know.

 When I did a search here the only thing that mattered was the heat loss, not the radiation (in my case), not the square footage, and certainly not upsizing a full section for an indirect hot water heater.  I had to pull myself away from what I had been told by some old-timers, who I feel had some disdain for smaller, poor-drafting units because they had a tendency to plug up.   I'm  guessing of course, but I think the larger units was an attempt to make up for a lack of mass when it comes to baseboard heat, thereby giving the burner a longer cycle and elevating the stack temp.  Also, when doing cut-throat residential bids, you could tell the customer "this one is bigger" and they would think its a better deal.   

R Mannino

I like em'

particularly with the NX.

Steamhead

There are several other boiler brands that are Biasi-based

one is the Solaia, seen here in both oil and gas trim. These were all sized to heat-loss calculations.



Solaias are sold thru the local Columbia depot, which is great to deal with. I think F.W. Webb sells Solaias under their own brand name too, but can't remember what that name is.



Obviously we like these boilers, since we keep putting them in!

Charlie from wmass

Your right Frank

FW Webb sells them as Trio boilers. I have installed a few and I like them. I do not know which Biasi they are based on.

RockBangorMaine

Comparison Biasi, Buderus, and Pensotti

When living in Baltimore, I read all of Dan Holohan's steam books (and hydro systems just for fun). I got a kick of 'tuning' the two-pipe steam machine the size of T-Rex in a 3500 sq ft home. Now, up in Bangor, Maine, I am hosting a modest house with a carbon foot print the size of a 1960's Sinclair Oil Refinery.



So, I am grateful to Mr. Holahan and this site and am happy to be here again.



The current smelting plant needs to be replaced with something a bit more appropriate for the home. I am looking for opinions on oil fired cold start boilers.



The three boilers, seven zones each, that I have proposals for are remarkably similar in cost (Pensotti > Biasi > Buderus). There is a grand difference high to low. At this point, I don't really care about the price. The decision now comes down to either intrinsic factors or which burner looks the sexiest. I'm hoping for an opinion.



Before getting the estimates, I predicted the Buderus to be out of my league. The comparison estimate was obtained for fun... (or masochism?).



These are all great systems, is there any reason I should choose one over the other?

RockBangorMaine

some help

I found this thread on another site helpful.



http://hvac-talk.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=402282

Hey_Obie

Thanks to all that have helped me

I started this thread a few months back when I was boiler searching. I thought I'd give an update and THANKS to all that have helped me thru this enjoyable and challenging adventure.



As I stated months ago, I had a large one pipe venturi system with a 175,000 HB Smith boiler burning 1.35 GPH in a 3000 sq/ft house. After having a professional come in and tell me that I needed to spend 10,000 on a Buderus 215/3 with and indirect, I decided to do it myself.



I broke my system into 4 zones and added and indirect with a nice variable speed Wilo that is so quite, I didn't think it was working (the Wilo was recommended here). I bought Dan's book and learned about Pumping Away and got my system working on the old boiler. With that behind me, I needed a new boiler. After discussions on this site about buying small, I changed from big thinking to small. I learned how to do a heat calc loss and came up with 80,000.



I was ready to buy the Biasi when a contractor buddy of mine redoing a home and needed a 4 year old Burnham V8 3 removed. So for the price of $0, I removed it and installed. While it is not a 3 pass as I would have liked, the price of $0 will offset the fuel savings of a new boiler for many years. And I definitely down sized to about a 90,000 btu boiler firing at .75 gpm.



I was going to do outdoor reset but the price of the controller always bothered me. Then someone on this site told me to buy the Beckett AquaSmart for $160. A great decision. Highly recommend it.



Just this past weekend, I redesigned my piping to install Primary/Secondary piping. In a few hours, I had it up and running.



So my system is complete. Could not have done it without this site. Thanks to all for comments and gentle prodding.



My cost for all that I did was around $2500. I saved at least $12,000 because what I did was at least $5000 more that what I was going to get for $10,000 from the pros.



Thanks again