Need for air seperator w/ LLH's?

Devan

I'm trying to justify to need for a Spirovent when using a LLH.

Buderus now has standardize their GB142 with a low loss header, I have not used

a Spirovent on the last three GB's I installed, although air removal has not really been a problem just looking for others opinions.



Thanks

CMadatMe

Air Sep

Devan I have found myself using more Caleffi LLH's and Taco's. Not very familiar with what Buderus offers. I do alot of Vitodens. Viessmann does offer them but there is no hy-vent with them. We have been using mostly the Taco for Vitodens 100 jobs (no sensor needed) and the Caleffi (has a spot for a temp sensor)  for Vitodens 200's. They are also give the boiler a much cleaner and an easier install. The Taco is 1" swt which fits realley nice and clean on those 100,000 btu's and less jobs where no temp sensor is needed and the Caleffi offers a nice union swt connection. Done about 60 jobs since Sept and zero problems.

Devan

Buderus LLH

Chris,



Buderus changed the pre made manifold pi/sec assembly with a LLH type set up.

basically square 3" stock with welded ends and 3/4" tappings.



I've used Caleffi, but really no need now since Buderus is giving you their version with the boiler.



I install a hy vent on top of the Caleffi or I will disconnect Buderus pre made unit, turn it vertical and put a vent on top.



Using a LLH, I dont see a need for a Spirovent, it would be nice if a elemnt could be inserted inside a LLH to help air removal . (hint, hint, manufactures)

Devan

double post

CMadatMe

I believe

Caleffi has now changed there LLH and added a polymere type screening similiar to the screening in a siprovent. I'd ask HR about that as he would have a much better grasp on the reason to why.. I didn't realize Buderus was packaging them in with the boiler. I would be curious as to why they made the change. I would think it was to protect that alum hx versus the magic potion that WM now provides with their boiler.

Devan

3rd generation Buderus GB

Although that could be the case Chris, I just think the pri/sec manifold they use to send was inferior at times, and a pain to pipe especially multiple boilers. And every so often I would see it still piped incorectly from others.



I noticed that Buderus did beef up the HX, and reconfigured the insides a little though a lot different from my oldest Buderus GB @ 6years now.



p.s. I'm still trying to find the time to make it to one of your meetings.



Regards

CMadatMe

Meetings

Your more than welcome anytime. Have Fujitsu coming on the 21st and doing a 3 hour class on the new tax credit units plus the new stuff coming out in June. Have 20 members so far and have had nothing but great responses. Working on getting the members factory training with a couple of the boiler mfgs right now on the mod/con and condensing equip. Goal is to get the guys factory trained on anything that they may come across in our market related to high efficiency.

heatboy

I don't see the need.

You will notice on the right side of the picture where the LLH is, I add a Taco 418 vent to the LLH.  That is the only automatic vent for the entire heating system, except the boiler vent on the Vitodens.  When I use Caleffi ( the other picture), I just use their vent as my system venting.  Never have any air issues. 

hot_rod

as long as

you have a good means to power purge the system/ loop first. As long as you have circulation through the llh it should remove residual air.



Still a good idea to have a small air vent on the high point in the boiler, especially on mod cons mounted above the llh and system piping. The small HXers need to be able to burp any small bubbles that may try to trap inside them.





hr