Can you recomend a simple, reliable boiler?

Mike_G

Hello, I am currently building a two story detached garage that will have radiant in the slab and under the second floor.  I am planning on running the boiler to an indirect tank at about 150 degrees, and then mixing the DHW and radiant from the tank.  I am just looking for a very simplistic, reliable boiler that I can easily get parts for anywhere. I haven't done any load calcs yet, so I can't say what size, but I will guess around 100K btus.  Any suggestions? 

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

Simple Boiler

Prestige Solo 110 made by Triangle Tube



[url=http://www.triangletube.com/TriangleTubeProductList.aspx?CatID=1]http://www.triangletube.com/TriangleTubeProductList.aspx?CatID=1



and if you want to get rid of the indirect tank, the Prestige Excellence will provide a limited amount of DHW.  It has a 19 gallon DHW tank that has a decent recovery rate.  It's the only combi boiler that I recommend.

EricAune

boiler

Gas, electric?  High efficiency (modulating/condensing)?  It would be best to do the heat loss calculation first.  Boiler selection may be limited depending on the heat load.  

Mike_G

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It will be gas.  I could be wrong, but I assume the requirement to be simplistic would eliminate most or all mod/cons. I work on overly-complex machines all day long, so the last thing I want is to deal with it at home too. Im sure a lot of you guys understand. I will do a load calc before I buy, however that is a few months out, so I would like to start researching some possible candidates. 

Alan (California Radiant) Forbes

Boiler

Maybe most ModCons, but the Prestige is very simple, straightforward, easy to set up and very reliable.  It's perfect for radiant because it loves low return water temperatures.  If you go with an atmospheric boiler, you've got to make sure it DOES NOT condense.



If push comes to shove, I like the Viessmann ECDS atmospheric boiler.  If you wire the primary pump through the boiler, the boiler will turn off the pump below 130° (I believe) for boiler protection.

EricAune

I'll agree

In the case of TriangleTube, I totally agree.  This boiler is designed to be dependable, efficient and comes at a pretty reasonable price all while being very versatile in its applications.



Depending on size and the system requirements, you may be able to pipe the TriangleTube without primary/secondary.  Compared to the added components (mixing device, and boiler protection loop) you will likely need for any cast iron boiler added to the potential for cost savings on venting and labor you might actually save up front with the mod/con.



Operation costs are definitely lower too.  

CMadatMe

Triangle

Nice little boiler. I do question not having to Primary/Secondary though. The boiler has built in freeze protection and pri/sec is required for that function. You would be giving up that function. The Vitodens 100 is also a nice little mod/con and  would not require pri/sec or low loss header as long as your flow rate doesn't exceed 6.2GPM or drops below 1.7GPM (62,000 btus) and (17,000 btu's). It is just as a competatviley priced as the Triangle.

TonyS

Burnhan, Weil Mclain, Utica

They all make excellent cast iron atmospheric boilers at 1/3 to 1/2 the cost of your average modcon. These units of course need a chimney. If you need sidewall venting, these units are all available with inducers that sidewall vent and some that draw outside air. But these units cost more and the al294c vent can add up quick. They can all be repaired with off the shelf parts at reasonable cost.

The Triangle tube Prestige is an excellent choice because its going to eliminate the venting cost associated with stainless by using pvc, also it has a low water cutoff built in which you would have to add to the cast iron. It also draws outside air which is vital in a garage. The Prestige is a little different than most modcons, Triangle tubes expertise lies in their robotic welding abilities. This skill allows them to build the exchanger into exactly the configuration they want without compromises to what they can just bend and stamp. This is why the Prestige is self cleaning, low pressure drop(no need for primary secondary) and is built of a ferritic alloy 439. From a welders standpoint the exchanger in a Prestige is a thing of beauty. I have been installing them for 5 years now and have yet to have a single breakdown. The repair parts are more in line than others I have worked on, and not really off the shelf. Every install is different  just as everyone's budget.

Big Ed_4

My Simple Gas Boiler Choice

Would be the Buderus G124X or need be the G234X , Around the same price as others , Nicely made , stainless burners and they use regular in truck stock Honeywell controls ... I would only add the Logomatic 2107 with the outdoor reset to run the indirect and heat loops ...

Jean-David Beyer

It also draws outside air which is vital in a garage.

My boiler is in my (attached) garage. My old boiler was, likewise. The old boiler just took the combustion air from two vents, one high up, and one  about 5 feet from the floor. Each vent was a little bigger than a square foot, though the effective size was less. It also got some from a gap under the garage door, but that cannot be counted. Presumably that amount of air makeup was considered adequate. When I bought the house, the engineer I had evaluate the house even suggested blocking off one of the vents (which I did not do).



The new boiler does get its makeup air from a 3" PVC pipe to outdoors, and the vent is also 3" to outdoors.



But why is makeup air from outside vital in a garage? I think it would be even more vital in a basement or utility room.

TonyS

Garages

It all depends what you do with your garage, but vapors mostly coming from cars, lawn mowers,cleaning compounds, if your heating your garage why burn heated air? Also code here is a boilers burners have to be 18" above the floor in a garage unless its sealed combustion.

I cant think of any reason you would want to draw inside air in a garage!

Jean-David Beyer

I cant think of any reason you would want to draw inside air in a garage!

I cannot think of any advantage to drawing inside air from my garage. I used to do it with the existing oil burner in my house. One of these (see pages 10 and 11):



http://www.heatinghelp.com/files/articles/1025/177.pdf



When I got a new mod|con, their installation manual pointed out not to get air from anywhere that harmful household chemicals (listed) might occur because the would harm the boiler. So there are good reasons to get fresh combustion air from outside.



I guess I was just thinking about this from the point of view of having enough air for proper combustion and preventing production of excess carbon monoxide. In that case, running it in my garage would be safer than were it inside the house somewhere because the house is better sealed than the garage, for one thing.

bill garnett_2

Simple with 2 stage

Lochinvar makes a nice residential boiler called the Solution. It comes standard with 2 stage firing -sweet simple little machine. Burnham series 2 is a qualifier as well.

kcopp

My Vote......

would be the Embassy Axia combi. They are quiet, have sealed combustion, wall hung and hot water all in one neat package. Not a lot to go wrong.  It is about 87% afue. It comes in 2 sizes... 160k and 90k

Mike_G

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Thanks everyone for all of the suggestions, I now have some work to do in researching them all a little bit more in depth.