I didn't think they could do it

Steve Ebels_3

But it appears they did.



Viessmann actually made a better Matrix burner from what I hear.



And this is what I heard, from a reputable source that will remain nameless.........lest that person wind up in trouble......



The new Vitodens runs on LP or natural gas with no modification. I think that's public knowledge.

The new Matrix not only modulates airflow to the burner but simultaneously and independently modulates gas flow also. As far as I know it's the only burner that does this. How it does this I don't know but so much for worrying about btu content of the fuel used. Problem solved.

Here's what i find amazing. The burner will provide 100% rated output down to 2" of natural gas pressure and 5-6" for LP.

I don't believe that you'll find that last one published anywhere in Viessmann's lit but again, this is from a reputable source.



Color me Silver and orange some more.

Mark Eatherton

I suspect....

that it is the Lambda Sensor that is making this all possible. No doubt, the Matrix is THE best burner in a mod con boiler, but I suspect Robert Bosch has more to do with the fuel/air ratio/adjustability than does the Matrix burner.



I also suspect that Viessmann is just one of the first companies to start using this technology on small mod cons and that the rest of the industry (as usual) will follow in hot pursuit.



BTW Steve, some time ago (this spring), someone asked what to do when business slowed down, and you suggested going for long walks in the forest, going fishing, and other cool things. Thank you. I took your advice, and disconnected myself from the city for 4 months. I spent my children's inheritance ON their inheritance. Had my own economic stimulus plan as it were.



I watched a bear swim a mile and a half in 20 minutes, watched an Eagle steal a nice salmon from an Osprey, watched many Eagles and Osprey catching fish, caught MANY fish (only kept what I needed for eating) and caught one nice Lake Trout that had a 3" rainbow trout lodged in its throat, saw fox being harrassed by Magpies, saw lots of deer, elk and moose and much more.



I now have the largest single array of radiant windows in one space (12 in total) which will eventually be powered by alternative energy (solar and wind power). I also have radiant walls, and ceilings, and a place called Hydronicahh.



Thanks for your advice! Much appreciated.



ME

Steve Ebels_3

Thanks Mark

I take it that you thought my advice was something complementalable (is that a word?)

Occasionally the phrase used in business "time to go out and beat the bushes" can carry multiple meanings.

Been doin' some long walking myself. Times they are a changin'.

The boys and I have been blessed in that we have had decent work all summer. Nothing to write home about but we aren't sitting around waiting for the phone to ring. Not getting ahead but not going behind either. It pays to have more than one iron in the fire so don't put all your eggs in one basket. ..............howzzat for a mixed mathaphor? I wish you all the best my friend. If you needed an investor and I had money I'd be calling you. Those windows intrigue the heck out of me.



As to the Vito burner,  it is Lambda based along with some other technology. The big news to me is that the price reduction comes through increased production efficiencies from what I hear. Not cheapening the product. A biggy was that the actual German HX in the Vito is now approved here in the US. In the past, V was forced by code officials here to make a special unit for our market. No more special production runs just for this market.  I never knew that until last week.



It'll be interesting to see how long it takes everyone to adopt this technology. It definitely addresses some valid concerns in regards to variations in fuel.



Speaking of bears.......my brother showed me several pictures from his trail cam that blew me away. He's got a mama black bear hitting his bait that has FOUR cubs in tow. From what I know about black bears, that is extremely rare. I'll see if I can get his SD card and upload a couple here.

nicholas bonham-carter

the great outdoors

everyone can benefit from the 40 days in the wilderness.

"watched an Eagle steal a nice salmon from an Osprey"

that was the sort of behaviour which caused Benjamin franklin to be disappointed in the choice of eagle as our national symbol. his choice of a more noble bird........the turkey!!-nbc

Clif Heeney_2

Green Mtn. Reservoir

What a GREAT place to take some time off Mark!



I hope that one of these days you post some photos of your heating system in operation.  Will you still be obtaining your wood chips from Sean?



Looks like the lake was way up, when was that photo with Smokey's little cousin taken?



Best Regards,



Clif

Robert O'Brien

It works

on the relationship between excess air and the and the microamps sensed by the flame rod.Amazing technology and no surprise Viessmann is out in front. It basically runs at 30% excess air at all times

TonyS

Oxygen sensors are not that amazing

or new. I was going to close the injection loop on my bike this year with a with wide band O2 sensors and ecm because it supposedly keeps the bike at peak all the time. I went to a bike shop in MD who specializes in these things and ask about how well they work. He went to the trash can right in front of me and said here... its the eighth one we removed this year.  It is really something you have to look at and decide how much more efficiency you are going to get compared to the cost of the sensors when they fail. Will it really be cost effective. Probably not.  But I guess you could say the same for a pilot over electric ignition. It will probably happen anyway.

Robert O'Brien

It's

It's NOT an O2 sensor! It uses the microamps from the existing flame rod.No new "sensor" to deal with!

TonyS

That sounds better

I thought they were using a lambda sensor. These boilers are so close to the upper end of squeezing out every btu that its at the point that one service call on these things will wipe out any fuels savings for the next 2 years. So dependability is a major issue now, more so than another 1% efficiency. 

Steve Ebels_3

I think that's the point..... reliability

One of the issues I have run into with some M/C boilers is fouling of the combustion chamber and HX. A couple were downright sooty. After cleanup the combustion test read spot on manufacturers recommendations without any adjustment to the burner. One can only assume that something outside the boiler caused the fouling in cases like that. I would suspect the culprit would be related to fuel supply pressure or variation in the btu content. If it were an air problem one would think that the vent switch would lock out before the burner got to the point where it was not combusting properly.  I'm not an expert on these matters but I do sleep in a Holiday Inn Express occasionaly.

Robert O'Brien

Exactly!

The gas valve modulates as well as the blower to maintain a target of 30% excess air.There are no additional parts,different gas valve and control but nothing that wasn't there before