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when to braise?

Timco
Timco Member Posts: 3,040
in THE MAIN WALL
So under what conditions should one braise? System I am on has leaks in 2 braised connections and one major leak in a soldered fitting. I am considering just braising all of them. several connections made of braise and solder. Why both?

Tim
Just a guy running some pipes.

Comments

  • Unknown
    Unknown
    What size pipe ?

    And what pressure and temp are they handling ? I'm guessing they tried to braze the soldered fitting because it was probably easier than pulling the fitting apart , cleaning it and resoldering .
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    Maybe

    Check out water in system, or is there antifreeze of some type. Seems like there may be a hidden issue. That could be why some joints are brazed. Or maybe the other guy just couldn't solder!
  • Timco
    Timco Member Posts: 3,040


    2" & 3" ftgs, 20psi, 180*. Glycol. It would really suck to take apart these fittings, which are close spaced tees in a pic sec intersection.

    Tim
    Just a guy running some pipes.
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    I've tried

    the ol' flux , solder , flux , solder trick on those problem jobs . Never seems to work .

    Will a braze joint hold in a dirty fitting ? The only brazing we do is on A/C lines , 3/4" maximum . Different scenerio but I had a leak on a 3 inch by 2 inch threaded tee in the middle of a primary secondary tree . Just had to bite the bullet and take it all apart . It actually went faster than I thought .

    Good luck with this one Tim .
  • bob_46
    bob_46 Member Posts: 813
    cap

    get a rosebud and some 15% sil-fos and cap all the joints.

    There was an error rendering this rich post.

  • Unknown
    Unknown
    ?

    Did you insert the glycol yourself? Could it not be blended properly? If to strong, it will add to your problems. Good Luck!
  • Paul Pollets
    Paul Pollets Member Posts: 3,661
    ProPress

    This is where ProPress fittings come in handy. Despite their cost, they don't leak when assembled correctly. You may be able to borrow or rent the tool and jaws.

    Trying to braze over an uncleaned joint is a recipe for trouble. Just my humble opinion.

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  • hot_rod
    hot_rod Member Posts: 22,830
    and maybe

    a thermal expansion induced problem. The pipe needs to have some room to move if it sees wide temperature swings. Don't fasten it solid on al corners. Unistrut clamps with the flexible inserts may be the way to mount the assembly.

    I'd cap it using a rosebud tip and some JW Harris Blockade. Blockade is a silicone based alloy material and is said to handle expansioin better then some of the other filler metals. It melts at a lower temperature than silflos and is very workable for capping joints.

    The Harris website has some excellent info about solder and braze material and procedures.

    Becareful torching on pipes with glycol, they can flame up on you. I'd isolate the section and flush it well with water.

    Same flush after you braze at high temperatures as you end up with a bit of black flakes inside the copper. No need for that in the glycol.

    hr
    Bob "hot rod" Rohr
    trainer for Caleffi NA
    Living the hydronic dream
  • Timco
    Timco Member Posts: 3,040


    well, the safety silver is pretty expensive, but works very well by sitting right in the joint. The Blockade was very easy to use, flux was not an issue to use. Have to say, the Lennox CU rods are just as easy to use with proper technique. I like brazing, I must say...I would have used pro press, but there IS glycol in the system, you now....

    Tim
    Just a guy running some pipes.
  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User] Posts: 672
    p-press not

    good that you stayed away from it

    harris also has a silver bearing solder #8 that's very good
  • Paul Pollets
    Paul Pollets Member Posts: 3,661
    ProPress and Glycol

    Where does it say that ProPress fittings shouldn't be used in Glycol systems? Just curious...

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  • bb_11
    bb_11 Member Posts: 39
    ProPress

    can be used on Glycol for heating and cooling systems up to 50% glycol mixture.

    There have been some issues of a slight leak w/ ProPress and glycol, but I don't believe that it is a serious issue.

    If you need to borrow a tool call Viega and ask your local District Manager if you can borrow a tool.

    Warm Regards,

    bb
  • Timco
    Timco Member Posts: 3,040


    After the great propress debate of '08, I decided to stick with a joint that I make, and know will never leak, thus braze. Many customers do not trust pex, and propress seems less tested than pex. The braze is very permanent and I like that...controlling my own destiny. I was actually joking when I mentioned it, but I have chosen to trade speed for known methods of permanent fixes.

    Tim
    Just a guy running some pipes.
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