Counter Flow Steam

Paul Fredricks_9

No actual job, just trying to get this design in my head. The basic near boiler counter flow piping is very simple. But what if there are two mains heading out to the house. and two risers. Anyone know how to pipe this? Anyone have a drawing for this type of set up?

The big issue here, I would think, is to keep the condensate from effecting the flow of steam.

Paul Fredricks_9

I guess I could treat the two mains as if they were two radiators. That's just a lot of condensate coming back into the header, even on a 45. Maybe you drip one of the mains before they get back. Make sense?

clammy

counter flow

Paul i have been lucky enough to see a few counter that where re pipe properly ,i'll try to explain pipe your header as you would normally when you install your tee's for your mains rise up and right after your first elbow to line up with your existing header install a tee which should face downward and that becomes your drip which enables all your condensate to drop down into your drip wet return tie them both together well below your boiler return tapping and come back up for your hartford loop.I have used this type of lay out for quite a few counter flow sysytems and they have worked fine ,there are other piping tech which basically have the same function some are kinda set up like you would drip a 2 pipe steam main which feeds off the top of a larger steam main only difference is you are using a f& t just a water seal .i have also found counter flow does not like hi pressure keep the system pressure as low as possible .Sorry i don't have any photos last time i did one i did not possese a digital camera .peace and good luck clammy

Paul Fredricks_9

Thanks, Clammy. I sort of follow you. I don't see the need for a Hartford Loop as there is no where for the water to leak from, no real return piping. Looking in the latest Lost Art on page 83 there is a drawing. My idea is to pipe the two risers as you would normally. The end of that main would drop down into a second main, like in the drawing. You'd then pipe in the first main as if it were a radiator. A drip leg would be needed to keep the condensate from flooding the piping to the second main. That drip leg could just tie into the drop going to the return tapping. I don't know if there is a required length (or height) of the drop. I think the big trick is keeping the steam as dry as possible. Not easy to do with a counter-flow.

BTW, both Lost Art and the Field Guide say no Hartford Loop required.

Yeah, I've seen the result of higher pressures. Makes a mess.

Steamhead (in transit)

I'd

build the usual header, dropping it if there are two risers. Take the two steam mains off as usual, then drip them full-size between the header and the first radiator. The drips could then be reduced a foot or so below the mains, but you want lots of room for the condensate to drip into them.

Another way is to have the drip at the beginning of the counterflow main, and bring the steam into the top of the main about a foot beyond the drip. Dan shows this method on page 83 of Lost Art.

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Paul Fredricks_9

That's sounds good Frank. Don't run into it very often, but it is nice to know when you do.

Dan C.

Soemone just asked the sam question the other day. I usually pipe it the same way I would a counterflow system with one main but take the second main off as a branch from the first main. Or I do it the way I drew in the picture below.

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Paul Fredricks_9

Yeah, that would work. The pic looks a little omplicated, but I guess it all depends on where the mains are in relation to the boiler. Thanks.