Drop Header or Not?

Michael P. Bourque

I did have a boiler pro come out and look. Like I said he recommends among all the other problems that I should get a drop header.


Here is the first attemp at piping. As you can see it's only one tapping, and the first main take off does not have a wet return - it drains right back into the trunk. This cools off the steam and produces a wet steam problem.

Also notice that the equalizer comes before any of the mains. According to all a I have read, this is a no no.

<img src="http://photos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-snc1/v1551/178/14/623864312/n623864312_967894_3336.jpg">

Michael P. Bourque

Drop Header or Not?

I have a new boiler with a single pipe steam system.

After the install, I have had many issues with wet steam due to improper near boiler piping. I am having my steam system re-installed with proper piping.

The install instructions give two options for installation with one option being a drop style header.

Everyone I have talked to including a steam expert who I hired to look at my system, says drop header is the best option.

However my installer is pushing back on installing a drop header on my single pipe steam system. He says its too much labor and not needed for my single family house. He also is telling me I don't need the additional taping used.

Looking for your advice.

Unknown

What brand and model boiler ?

It sounds like a Burnham ? They have great diagrams for their steamers .

Some of their boilers do only require one of the steam tappings . But they recommend using the 2nd tapping , and I do too . About the drop header - if you decide on piping the 2 tappings , dropping the header can be as simple as using 2 extra street ells . That's out standard way of piping our drop headers .

kpc_68

why not...

it is not that much extra labor and in some cases it will save you some... what boiler is it... that will be the determining factor as to the "need " for the second tapping....kpc

Supply House Rick

drop header or not?

by implication, the installation of your new boiler should result in proper function. this would mean that the installer should follow the manufacturer's instructions, without deviation, AT A MINIMUM. wet steam is not proper function!

if this minimum piping arrangement still does not give functionality, then the installer must make any changes necessary to the piping setup to make it work. so if not now, then maybe later the drop-header will be required. as far as the extra riser goes, is this shown as needed in the non drop-header layout in the installation manual?

i don't think the extra fittings and pipe is such an added expense. could you say that you will pay for the material cost of extra fittings needed now for a drop-header; however if he doesn't take you up on the offer, then the cost of the drop-header, should it be needed later, will be entirely his.

this would be a good time to ensure you have good low pressure with a vaporstat set to 12 oz. max, with good main venting to get the air out.--nbc

Unknown

extra fittings

Extra fittings can be a real labor savings, espically on the crooked threads on bolier tappings. There may be another issues that cauing the wet steam. Sounds like you really needs to get a REAL boiler pro.

jim s_2

Installers

Doesn`t sound like he knows what he`s doing if he`s coming back to pipe it again.

Stand firm and make sure you get what you want not what they want to give you.

Michael P. Bourque

It's a Burnham independence.

Michael P. Bourque

I believe the owner of the company does know what he is doing. But he relies on his employees to install and perhaps they just don't have the years of background.

One good thing is that he has read Dan's books, so I have some confidence here. However like I said, he really wants to save labor and skip the drop header. He also says I dont need an extra taping.

I was once told and read somewhere that even if the boiler had 10 tapings, it's best to use every single one.

Unknown

then why wasn't he?

Then why wasn't he there on the job to make sure the employees was installing the correct pipings? Otherwise, you would'nt need to come on to heatinghelp....
You can have your very own books from the "steamy deals" from this site

Unknown

Did a

plumber do the steam piping ? Looks more like a drainage stack than a steam header .

What's the exact model number of your Independence boiler ?

clammy

drop header and drop that contractor

both with one breath ,if he know what he is doing then his employees should have instructed and know what to do with there boss up there butts,looking at that so called steam header is a headache .That boiler should be repiped with a drop header period and your mains should be checked to insure that your system is a parrell flow and not a counter flow and be repiped with that in consideration. From the looks of it it seems that they where clueless only desent thing they did was do it in black pipe .Aside from that it needs a total re pipe and probalby a diagram so the installation mech have some thing to go by maybe they should attend a semair or two ,sorry to sound mean but i see it all the time it's sicken peace and good luck clammy

Techman

header

What is the BTU load of the house and,what is the boiler firing at?

bob young

dangerous guy

that mechanic has absolutely no business working on a steam system. he has not a clue as to how steam works. but even worse , he is not capable of reading a SIMPLE piping diagram. that is the scary part. he will void the warranty on your equipment if he continues to work on it because he is not qualified. he is the wrong man for the job. i hope he did not wire it. he is capable of burning your house down or blowing it up.

Mad Dog_2

if YOU are willing spend a little more

Why would he have a problem? Drop headers can never hurt when done correctly. Mad dog

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Mad Dog_2

yep......thats no excuse

We have companies around us like that....nonsense....your employees are a direct reflection on you. Mad dog

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j a_2

jJR

Was wondering what you ment by must have been a plumber and what kind of stack your talking about SOIL WASTE OR VENT

bob young

wrong layout.

his riser is set up like a drainage tree, instead of building a steam header w/ individual horizontal take-offs. not a bad pipefitter-plumber mechanic but absolutely no steam expertise. if he only read the piping diagram he could have done a great job. he can definitely fit pipe. this is a situation that happens all too often & is completely avoidable. READ THE DAMN BOOKLET. ONE PIPE STEAM IS ACTUALLY PRETTY EASY ONCE YOU GET THE HANG OF IT.

Unknown

No knock to plumbers

But what is supposed to be a steam header looks more like a drainage system , done primarily by plumbers . Soil , waste or vent ...... take your pick .

Didn't mean to offend any plumbers .

j a_2

thanks ron jr

Sorry if I missunderstood your post..I do agree that install was poor at best I must say you get what you pay for..I say if you cant do it right the first time you cant do it correct the second time. They always call back JA

V8toilet

Go with the drop header, you won't be sorry.

steve_29

The owner should be ashamed of himself.

He can blame anyone he wants, it's still his job and business, it's his fault. Period.

He should make it right and it doesn't matter whether he misquoted the job, my guess is he did and looking for a cheap way out.

Michael P. Bourque

Re: Drop Header or Not? (Solved)

All,
Thank you for the great responses and answers to my questions. Based on all the feedback, I insisted on the drop header. I also did a lot of my own research into the other problems that can plague an install (bull headed tees, counter flows, pipe slope, need for close nipple on wet return, etc).

Today my system was fully repiped per the install manual with a drop header. Even though its only been a day, I can tell you that it has made a huge difference. Radiators that were cold since we moved in are suddenly heating! There also has not been a single water bang.

I will post pictures soon and a new posting about my saga and the successful remedy to solve all my problems.

However I just wanted to write you all and let you know how much you contributed to getting my issues solved.

The dead men would be proud!