Vitocell Tanks

Robert O'Brien

a look at a cutaway Vitocell 300,the quality and thickness of the stainless is incredible.It's a matter of personal choice as to whether having the very best is worth it or not

Man with a question

Vitocell Tanks

I need to hear from from the Viessmann devotees out there, and everyone else as well, on why Vitocell Stainless tanks are worth twice as much as a Superstor or any other choice.

We install Vitodens boilers exclusively. I have always been able able to justify the expense by their exemplary build quality and reliability, the fact that the primary pump is on-board etc.

But Viessmann tanks? There are no moving parts in a tank.

I believe Viessmann tanks are built better than anything else out there. I know they they have an inspection panel and a lifetime warranty.

Will they actually make more hot water faster with, say, a Vitodens 6-24 80mbh boiler?

I have looked over the performance data. It is confusing as each mfgr publishes different criteria.

Help me try to justify a $2,200 difference between a Viessmann tank and an HTP tank.

If, for example, someone has found that I can get the same recovery from a Vitocell 53gl tank as an HTP 80gl tank, then I would see it.

We often install SuperStors and Smart Tanks.

Obviously I would like to sell all Viessmann all the time if possible, but especially in this economy I need some back-up.

What's the word?

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greeny

I had same question. HTP is 45 min ride from my house and toured their plant for vision training. Also been to germany and yes vitocell manufactuing is top notch, superstor a bit more crude although when i was at HTP they were about to upgrade their line w/ computer automated welding. That was 5 years ago. Vitocell HX is 1" stainless through out w/ no fins to attract scale etc. HTP is cupronickel w/ fins and coil has higher pressure drop. Lifetime to lifetime warranty...I've installed prob. 80 SSUs and never had one come back.

Paul Pollets

VitoCells

Only the VitoCells are made with 316ti stainless. Other manufacturers use 316, at best. The VitoCell coil (also 316ti) has a larger bore diameter and is longer than any other coil, hence the faster recovery rates. The tanks are robotically welded and x-ray inspected. No other manufacturer does that. The Viessmann warranty is not pro-rated, it's unconditional for residential use. Is that worth it? To some customers, yes, to others, no. Comparing the recovery rates can be tricky, if you have difficulty reading the charts. The recovery depends not only on the BTU's available to the water tank, but the incoming CW temperature, distance from the tank to the boiler and pump size.

I'll provide a TT Smart tank, if the customer wants to save some $$. The customer also knows there will be a labor charge, if anything goes wrong with the alternate tank.

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Robert O'Brien

Take

a look at a cutaway Vitocell 300,the quality and thickness of the stainless is incredible.It's a matter of personal choice as to whether having the very best is worth it or not

Man with a question

Vitocell Recovery

Paul,

I also like triangle tanks because of the low pressure drop.

Have you found you can use a Vitocell v-300 53gl with a 6-24 where you would otherwise use a triangle smart 80?

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Paul Pollets

Yes, but

I'm less concerned with the recovery rates, than trying to steer the customer to the better equipment. I like "Systems" using the same mfg's equipment. I try not to 'hybridize". The customer will tell me if they can step up to the VitoCell. If not, we'll use another tank.

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Unknown

The tank itself

is 1 inch think stainless ?

Ted_5

Have you seen a HTP cut away?

look at the welds, they over lap the two pieces the just weld the out side of the tank. There is a gap on the in side of that tank. Vi tanks are all but welded with no fillers used in the weld. The have a picture of one of the Vi tanks that was filled to 550 PSI. It did not blow a part, it did bulge but did not break. The Vi tanks do need less boiler water temps to transfer heat. They only need 15 degress from boiler water to tank temp to recover. If you wanted your DHW at 120, then the boiler water only needs to be 135. Of course it is much faster at higher boiler temps.

Ted

Robert O'Brien

Ron

No,the tank walls are thick but not that thick! I would estimate 4x the wall thickness of the competition.

Constantin

Consider your options.

The Vitodens stainless tanks are nifty because they offer a very large surface area for the HX, a very high-grade tank material, and other features such as multiple well locations and multi-coil operation... For example, a 80-gallon Vitocell 300 B with its ability to run on a solar system and a standard boiler is pretty cool. The horizontal units can run off straight steam...

However, my recollection is that these units are not the kings of heat transfer - those crowns go to turbomax, ergomax, and Triangle-Tube. Not sure that ergo and turbomax are made in 'residential' sizes (whatever that means these days), but the only downside to the Triangle-Tube product is that cleaning it with its tank-in-tank design could be 'interesting'. That said, the good heat transfer allows you to run cooler water temps which will reduce scaling issues in areas with hard water.

I would not be a fan of tanks using finned heat exchangers for areas with hard water due to potential scaling issues unless the client has a water treatment system. IMO, a smooth-walled HX (on the water side) is less likely to accumulate scale and more likely to "pop" it off when the HX tubes expand and contract than a spiny one. Amtrol used to own this market...

So, if my task were to sell Vitocells, I'd highlight the quality of construction, heat transfer, etc. but I'd also have other indirects water heaters in my portfolio in case the client would want to spend money elsewhere. After all, a higher-efficiency AC system, desuperheater, solar system, etc. may prove to have a better payback. That said, my Vitocell has given me flawless service, and I sleep without worry.