CO IN CO

Ken Field

least obvious CO facts are, don't use a line powered detector because it will not be powered when the power is out and you have the gas grille in the living room. It also will read a diluted indoor air mix when there is severe infiltration through the outlet it is plugged into.
Good luck with the article, post a link so we can read it too.

Derheatmeister

CO IN CO

I was contacted by a organization in the High county(Colorado)to Write a Article about things to watch out for when it comes to CO safety...

As most of you maybe know we had some deaths in Colorado over thanksgiving in Aspen, some in a student housing and another one incident a ice skating rink just the other day.

Since these incidents The home centers are not able to keep detectors on the shelve very long..

"They" are even thinking about Mandating CO detectors throughout Colorado..

I got a rough idea what to talk about: i.e. Detectors on each level,at Sleeping level, usage of proper venting Materials,Proper venting practice, the possibility of negative pressure on dwellings..

But do not want to leave anything out..

What better people to ask then all of the great "Wallies"?

I take this very seriously.Any suggestions are gratefully appreciated and may even save Life's Thank all in advance Richard.

Unknown

Get in touch with

Jim Davis he can give you some good info.

Derheatmeister

UL listing,Battery backup

Ken thanks, I'll keep that in mind

I did not know that the UL listing will allow that "Plug in" detectors can be manufactured with out having a battery backup nowadays ,the "night hawk" has it build into it.
I will take a closer look at that!

Also: do you think that infiltration thru a outlet can be that great that it can produce a "false" reading? and if so shall the manufactures make a "Escutcheon plate" to prevent this from happening?

Tim Weaver

maintenance

Suggest that maintenance of heating equipment is important. These deaths would not have occurred had the equipment been firing correctly and the vents inspected and upgraded where needed. As far as running engines indoors without ventilation-just plain ignorant; but it happens everyday in supermarkets, warehouses, etc.

Chas_9

Whole House Fans

Put a lockout on the fricking things. Boiler + Coil + Whole House Fan = Death.

Tim Weaver

And one other thing

Colo should pass legislation requiring Contractor Licensing on a statewide level for Heating and Ventilating; and then implement ENFORCEMENT, which has not been done effectively with Plumbing and Electrical. There are way too many fly-by-nite types doing shoddy work and they are literally GETTING AWAY WITH MURDER!
Now is a good time to re-introduce the idea; with tract homes at a slowed pace, the Homebuilders Association powers may be reduced. They effectively blocked it last time around. I have heard from reliable sources that monetary strongarm tactics were used against supply houses that supported State Licensing.
And then you could suggest that the new State HVAC Board could hire competent Inspectors and supply them with kneepads and flashlights, and make them accountable.

Rudy

UL 2034

If you want to get up to speed on the performance and reliability of CO alarms, here is an interesting read: http://www.gastechnology.org/webroot/app/xn/xd.aspx?it=enweb&xd=10abstractpage/020112.xml

They sum it up saying "Results indicate that certification to UL 2034 does not assure the performance or reliability of CO alarms."

GRI found 38% of UL approved alarms (actually purchased at retail outlets) failed, brand new, right out of the box and the rest either alarmed to soon or too late.

Like Plumdog said, you'ld better test at the potential source.

The family that died in Aspen was due to (my understanding) a plastic vent falling apart above a drop ceiling. I'd argue that if it was set up properly to begin with it wouldn't have killed the family - there was a problem from day one.

As to the 23 year old woman who died in the apt complex. My understanding was the vent cap was blown off, someone put the cap back on and the vent "malfunctioned". How does a pipe "malfunction"?

My guess is that boiler is still operating dangerously...

JMHO

Rudy

UL 2034

If you want to get up to speed on the performance and reliability of CO alarms, here is an interesting read: http://www.gastechnology.org/webroot/app/xn/xd.aspx?it=enweb&xd=10abstractpage/020112.xml

They sum it up saying "Results indicate that certification to UL 2034 does not assure the performance or reliability of CO alarms."

GRI found 38% of UL approved alarms (actually purchased at retail outlets) failed, brand new, right out of the box and the rest either alarmed to soon or too late.

Like Plumdog said, you'ld better test at the potential source.

The family that died in Aspen was due to (my understanding) a plastic vent falling apart above a drop ceiling. I'd argue that if it was set up properly to begin with it wouldn't have killed the family - there was a problem from day one.

As to the 23 year old woman who died in the apt complex. My understanding was the vent cap was blown off, someone put the cap back on and the vent "malfunctioned". How does a pipe "malfunction"?

My guess is that boiler is still operating dangerously...

JMHO

Unknown

Here is a site I ran across on CO. Site is a bit disorganized and slightly fanatical though might have something you can use.

http://www.coexperts.com/

Mark Eatherton

Great idea, but....

The last time we attempted to ramrod HVAC licensing through the state legislature in Colorado, the usual resistance factors were there (HBA etc..) but the BIGGEST objection came from (drum roll please) The City and County of Denver!!

If you are seriously interested in getting involved in the legislative process and attempting to get HVAC licensing in to law, I will try and resurrect the adhoc committee that I was a part of that tried and failed to get it in to law.

It's is was a frustarting, uphill battle, with lots of ignorance along the way.

Richard, I think you should also address the other means of getting CO poisoning, like running a car in an attached garage, running a barbeque or gas powered generator inside the home, etc etc.

Jim Davis can be reached through https://www.nationalcomfortinstitute.com/members/noaccess.cfm

ME

Rudy

Question...

Fanitical and disorganized or passionate? I have two CO alarms in my own home. One is CO Experts, the other is NCI - neither is UL approved....
In my own home, I am the "authority having jurisdiction". If you mandate I have a UL approved CO alarm in my home and want to come up my driveway to check them out, you'd better have a warrant (or a pizza)....

bill_105

I said it once and I'll say it again.

A boiler or furnace can be equipped with it's own detector. Some manufacturer had to have thought of this. It can be done.

Unknown

Rudy-
Yes I'll agree with the passionate and it sounds like they have a good product. My comments were about the organization of the website itself. From a marketing standpoint it needs help.

Tim Weaver

I would be interested.

I can't imagine why The C&C of big D would have objections to State Licensing. They already have a slick-operating Dept. of Public SAFETY, as do other Suburban Cities. They have their own license requirements for Plumbing, Electrical, HVAC, and just about everything else. The more rural counties use the State Electrical and Plumbing Board to supplement local Building and Zoning; and the State oversees Public School Facilities in all jurisdictions. Unless maybe they don't want anybody poking around their school buildings with a critical eye towards HVAC.
I have brought forth this subject at the Plumbing Board in the past, and the idea was dismissed as "a can of worms"; or "a battle you cannot win". And it is because there is no public support. And there is no support because the public is largely unaware of the danger.

Mars_3

Mark I would join that battle with you