Adding more radiant to system

cheftim_2

bump

cheftim_2

Adding more radiant to system

3 years ago I installed a Buderus with the 2107 controller. I put in radiant thick plates on first floor and baseboard on the upper level. Doing some more renovations and now have installed radiant on the upper level since I had to tear a lot of the ceiling down. I'm also doing some radiant wall up there.

I have the FM241 card and mixing valve with the BFU on the radiant zone. I'm trying to decide the best way to add the 10 new loops of radiant.

1. Use the current loop adding the new manifolds in parallel to the existing 10 loop. With just one BFU, I guess placement will be critical so both upstairs and downstairs are heated correctly. Will the currently 3 speed Grunfos be able to provide the flow through all of this?

2. Add a mixing valve to the circulator currently driving the baseboard upstairs and use the signal from the FM241 card to drive the mixing valve. (if even possible) Might solve some of the flow issues but not resolve the fact that there still isn't a BFU providing feedback for the new upstairs radiant.

3. Same as 2 but don't get signal from FM241. Maybe use a Tekmar controller and sensor and another mixing valve in a fashion similar to what the FM241 is doing on the first floor.

Looking for guidance as to best approach and controls.

Thanks

Mark Custis

I move BTUH

not electrons.

I even use just room thermostats to control radiant systems.

I guess I am of no help.

cheftim_2

Yeah, looking for a more controlled approach allowing me to modulate the water temp with a mixing valve and sensor.

Anyone else?

cheftim_2

Called Buderus Today

They recommended using a Tekmar with the outdoor and indoor sensor. Is the 365 overkill?

CMadatMe

Scrap the Buderus Control

Are you willing to scrap the buderus control? If so, take a look at the wirsbo climate control. You will still be able to use the ESBE (Buderus) modulating mixing vlv for your 1st floor an will be able to add an additional modulating mixing vlv for your addition. The control will also give you outdoor reset for your boiler and indirect priorty for your domestic. The control will even turn a light on in the house if you want it to.

The control is not a control in the aspect of your current buderus control but a software program that you dictate what you want to control. Basically your designing your own custom control stragety for your needs. It'll give you the best bang for your buck while also allowing for any future addtions.

You cannot add an additional FM card to your current control. You would have to add some other type of control, (ie, TEKMAR, Taco RMB etc). Why not simplify your system to 1 control? Adding an addtional manifold may not give you what you are looking for. I'm sure that the addition is not on the same heating curve as the 1st floor. Wouldn't you like to be able to fine tune your system to your living conditions? Best of Luck..

cheftim_2

Too much money

Wow! Nice unit but way too much invested to throw out the Buderus.

I've been looking at the Taco RMB and iSeries. The one piece I'm not seeing in the intelligent mixing valves is I don't see where you provide room sensor input. Is there such a beast?

If there isn't, it looks like one of the Tekmars. Not sure which of those takes a room sensor. Still need help.

CMadatMe

There is

How about a nice set point control that will sense floor temp or air temp seperately or a combinbation of both. It's also programable and will learn the curve the room. Take a look at the Wirsbo 511's. I will again go back to the fact that I think you should scrap that Buderus control. You can use the exisiting modulating mixing vlv.

cheftim_2

Hmm

So the 511 appears to be an on/off control that learns the heating curve of the room to be more effective/efficient.

I like the fact the current radiant install is in constant circulation and the water temp is modulated. I don't believe I can do that with the 511.

Can someone recommend a Tekmar/Taco control to accomplish water temp modulation with outdoor reset etc like the way the Buderus fm241 card is doing?

cheftim_2

iSeries

This valve seems like a good choice but is there a way to introduce a tstat so you can vary the temp in the room? From what I see, you set a design temp for the supply and that's it. What if the wife wants the room warmer?

CMadatMe

Can you

Provide a piping diagram of your existing system?