Oil burner - have to purge line each time or burner times out

James_26

I was incorrect. The bypass plug is not installed, rather a normal plug for the hole is installed in the return port since I do have a single-pipe system.

Thank you for your help. I think I'm probably done posting here if there's not going to be any hands-on advise.

I understand your position, however. Thank you.

James_26

I have a Beckett Oil Burner; it’s a new unit. I installed it and had a serviceman come out and dial it in. It worked fine for about a month.

I think my problem arose last weekend when I popped the prime valve to get some oil in a bucket to clean some parts. The way I did it was I turned the thermostat up and let the burner kick on. The burner fired, I opened the valve, and the excess oil drained into the bucket. I thought this would be fine, but shortly after, my burner started acting up.

When the thermostat calls for heat, the burner times out. I can solve this by opening up the prime valve, it shoots out some short bursts of air before it starts running steady, I close the valve, and the burner kicks on. At first, it only would run for about 10 seconds after the igniters turn off. I got the idea to put it in prime mode so it would run for 4 minutes continuously without kicking off to bleed the line. Well, I did that a couple times and one time I just bled for a minute or so and shut the valve...the burner kicked on and ran until the thermostat kicked it off. PROBLEM SOLVED? Not so fast.

Unfortunately, when the thermostat makes another call for heat, the control box times out. If I go down and push the button to reset and crack the prime valve, it releases a little air and starts running, close the valve, burner kicks on and off we go. This latest time, it would actually run for a few minutes before kicking off. It seems to me like there’s air in the lines, but I’m not sure how it’s getting there. I’ve checked and can’t find any leaks. The tank has about 150 gallons of heating oil in it (about a year old). The filter is new. The whole burner including nozzle and electrodes are new & have no gunk on them. Again, as long as the electrodes are igniting, the thing will burn just fine, when they kick off, it’s got 10 seconds to a few minutes before it kicks off.

Any ideas?

It’s just a single pipe system, which I’ve heard often have issues w/ air in the lines, but the people before me used this system (w/ old burner) for 27 years, so it must not have any major flaws as far as fundamentals go.

Norm Harvey

If you can hear the fire rumbling inside (and not just the whirr of the fan motor) does the burner go off on reset while the fire is still burning, or does it never ignite, and your just hearing the whirr of the fan motor?

Is your oil like gravity or overhead?

It sounds like you could use a burner guy in there.

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J.C.A._3

I'm going with Norm....

Call a pro. You're flirting with frozen pipes and feeding the family cold mornings.

Sorry if you don't like the advice...but there is also a safety reason. Just do it...and save yourself the time and money. Chris

James_26

I didn't have heat all last winter and my pipes didn't freeze (they run between the basement & upstairs).

I'm by no means a master at this stuff, but I've read quite a bit last winter when I tried to fix it.

The burner actually fires up with the electrodes...the electrodes go off (as they're supposed to) and the fire continues to burn for as little as 10 seconds or as much as a few minutes. The fan for the heat exchanger doesn't kick on until it heats up in there. The oil tank is outside above ground. I believe it's gravity feed (the tank is higher than the burner). It only shoots out air bubbles when I crack the valve open...after that, it runs a steady stream...even when priming for 4 minutes.

I'm asking for advice to try and troubleshoot the problem myself before I pay some guy $200+, $100 of which is just for him to drive out here and back.

Any advice appreciated. And, yes, I understand that a tech on site would do a lot better than I can myself, but I like to try to fix stuff myself if possible. The last tech I had out here to set it up didn't do anything that I didn't do to begin with, he just basically had to use trial and error.

Norm Harvey

Good luck James

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J.C.A._3

Again..I'll agree with Norm....best of luck. Chris

Leo_17

First you ask

Given you had bad luck with the tech who came call someone else. First ask if they use combustion testing equipment, then ask for a service call to both set it up with equipment then to check the line. The line should be updated with a sleeved line, use flared fittings then work from there. I'm sure you don't want the liability of an oil spill, a good company is experienced and insured.

Leo

tommyoil

Where are you located?

I have just one or two questions if I may....
What model of beckett? Did you pay heed to the instructions with regard to air tube insertion depth? What head is on that particular burner? And what is the firing rate/spray pattern ect? What is it firing into? What is the current fuel pump pressure and vacuum readings. Top or bottom feed on the outdoor above ground tank? What kind of ohm readings are you getting from the cad cell eye? Filters all new and fuel pump strainer clean for sure? Gravity flow from the tank? Is there an overhead oil supply line? Has the unit been cleaned and/or serviced recently? Bypass plug in the pump?(shouldnt be if its brand new) You did say single pipe right? What are your combustion test results? What did the tech say when he "dialed it in" with regard to test results? Once you have all the answers to these VERY BASIC oil burner questions maybe we can offer some CONSTRUCTIVE advice. After all, homeowners are what makes this site tick. Without you guys, all here would be lost and HH.com as we know it, would collapse. That said....you should call a pro unless you have the equipment to troubleshoot and diagnose yourself. You avoided the cost of just having the burner installed by someone qualified to install AND troubleshoot. You most likely avoided any mark up by purchasing the burner yourself(which should be against the law) and now you want to find a way out of a $100.00 service call which could mean the difference between safe and unsafe. So much for the savings on this "do it yourself" project. Get some readings and report back with all the results and maybe some help can be had. Where are you located?

James_26

This is long....you asked and you receive

I thoroughly looked (called every heating place in the phone book that I saw) for someone to troubleshoot my problems last winter. I called one guy and he helped, but didn't fix the issue and didn't have the correct calibration equipment. I purchased the unit and installed it using advice I read online.

I purchased Bacharach Fyrite Pro 125 to do the "testing," but surprise, I really didn't know how to effectively use it, so it was of little help...still have it and selling it on ebay as we speak. I got word of mouth of a company that does commerical boiler work & called them. I DID ask them if they had equipment to set it up right because I didn't just want someone GUESSING and they said "yes, but he usually don't use it on residential." I stressed that I DID want equipment used to do it right...they set up and appointment and came out. He did not have equipment and said w/ the lower flowing rate burners, it usually doesn't matter. He basically used trial and error, but it worked fine (basically what I had done myself, I just didn't have the patience to continue thinking that a tech would have some ADVANCED know-how based on experience and that I - a lonely do-it-yourself homeowner could never get it right.

Long story short, I hate this set up. It's a 30 year old LONGWOOD dual fuel furnace that utilizes oil and wood. The Burner is a Beckett w/ a F0 head, a 9" air tube (what the furnace requires), a .75 gph 60* nozzle (new), a new filter. The bypass plug is installed because it's a single line system...this is ALL set up how it originally was.

The oil tank is above ground and the pipe runs from the bottom of the tank, it goes 2 feet underground and runs about 125 feet into the house and runs through a copper line, then through the filter, then to the fuel pump. The fuel pump is the clean-cut fuel pump w/ the valve on delay.

This thing WORKED just fine for a month after he came out. What I'm saying is that this ALL happened WHEN I THE STUPID HOMEOWNER cracked the purge valve to put some heating oil in a bucket to clean parts.

If someone can work on their car themselves - potentially creating a hazard for many other people - why should they not be able to work on their own furnace? I understand that SOME people should not work on things, but I've worked on cars for years now, I have a college degree, generally a good amount of common-sense, and I try to read and research before making decisions, so all I'm asking is for any tips or ideas on what you PROFESSIONALS would troubleshoot if you were to come to my house.

If you were in the MARSHFIELD, MISSOURI area, I would call you. I'd like to try to fix this myself. If I have to call a heating tech back out and pay them $200 to spend half an hour on my furnance, then I will. I plan to eventually go to a geothermal heat pump, and this may be the final straw if I can't get this thing fixed for a reasonable amount of money.

Again, I appreciate all of your help and advice, but I hate being told I have to take my car to the "dealer," when it's something I and others have been doing ourselves for years, and I hate paying some guy $200 to come out here and fix something I can do myself.

HONESTLY...Thank you for your help.

EDIT: I just changed the oil filter and put a new one on there (the other one was new as well). I poured the heating oil from the old filter into the new one. The burner kicked on after I cracked the purge valve to let the air out. It shut off a few minutes later. I checked the filter again and it was dry...which is probably why the unit shut off. I put some more oil in the filter, cracked the valve to purge the line, and BAM, the burner turned back on. I kinda think more than ever that I have a leak somewhere. It seems that the pump is able to pull some oil through the line w/ what vacuum it can provide.

OR

maybe it's the fact that when I cracked the valve before, it created less vacuum, which didn't pull as much oil into the filter...when I shut it down, it had air in the line. I would think that bleeding the line for 10 to 15 minutes would solve the issue...I'll try to bleed some more I guess.

EDIT #2: I just bled 2 gallons through it, so doesn't this mean that it receives the oil just fine?

steve_29

The bypass plug should not be in a single pipe fuel system.

If it's in, take it out, I'm not sure why the pump seal didn't blow.

Then get somebody out there that really is an oil burner technician, before something serious happens.

R Mannino

Bypass Plug

That's not the plug that the guys are talking about. It's the plug underneath that one.

http://www.suntecpumps.fr/Suntecus/PDFs/Installation and Service Manual - Section II.pdf


Ron