skimming sugestions

World Plumber

I have a new Perless instulation. The manual recomends using TSP. Have you used this in the past? Does it work well if done according to the directions? I was taught do skimimg using just water. Firing the boler but not allowing it to steam.

nicholas bonham-carter

skimming sugestions

last winter we replaced all the 2in. near boiler wet return piping on our peerless 211-a.due to the cold weather skimming was minimised and maybe not so thorough as i would like to do now before the winter sets in.
peerless recommends using "arm&hammer"[not the oil man] washing soda to shake loose the oil and then a long skim.
would it be wise for me to fill the new wet returns with this solution as well as the boiler because that is where any oil would be coming from?i have plenty of hot water nearby to fill the pipes with.--nbc

Brad White_200

I suppose

so long as you keep the solution from boiling and getting up into the steam piping to loosen that which ought not be loosened, I would give the "water-line down" a good hot soak.

If you do just the boiler and not the piping, I can see that prolonging your agony and undoing your skim efforts at the boiler.

But from what you are doing, I would clean the piping separately if you can, from the boiler. As you say, that is where the oil is, why cart it into the boiler when a good hot rinse and soak will get 95% of it taken out at the source?

If Peerless recommends A&H washing soda, who am I to argue? I am glad that they suggest something at least. I use that in laundry but am not sure what is in it. I suspect a TSP substitute of some sort if not Borax.

Enough manufacturers are saying "no chemicals" (including the time-honored TSP), that it kind of limits the options.

David Nadle

Sodium Carbonate

Washing soda is sodium carbonate. "Arm & Hammer" baking soda is sodium bicarbonate.

I beleive the sodium carbonate binds with the oily molecules and converts them into something like soap, so they precipitate out and can be removed.

The guys who installed my boiler added a bunch of sodium carbonate. I don't think it was very effective.

Brad White_200

TSP

Trisodium Phosphate, is one of those "old-timey but really works well" chemicals. It is getting hard to find in quantity and some say it will be eventually phased out due to excess phosphates acting as fertilizer in ponds, streams and other waterways, causing algae and other choking vegetation to flourish.

Still, we specify it as the initial gross cleaning of any new or some old systems. One pound to each 50 gallons of water and heated to at least 180 degrees but not to boiling of course. We also mention "caustic soda", but I think I will have to research, update and clarify that one. "Caustic Soda" is what a lot of teenagers drink these days in 20 oz. bottles.

Anyway, this treatment goes for even welded piping, not just threaded. Cutting oils aside, all pipe has casting and forming oils in the grain and pores, not to mention that annoying varnish. Not sure if TSP gets any internal varnish out though.

What I like about TSP is that it residually raises the pH of water to about 8.0 to 8.5, it rinses cleanly and you can tell it's presence by a slight "slippery" feel to the water, silky to the hand. Once that is gone, the water is clear if also visibly clear of dissolved solids.

nicholas bonham-carter

caustic soda

caustic soda is lye which can emusify animal fatty solids and make soap [and bio-diesel].early pioneers got it by straining water through wood ashes.it must also work on mineral oils.
it also reacts nicely with aluminum to form hydrogen gas!try mixing some with cooking foil and dishwashing liquid in a glass bottle to make floating bubbles which can explode when lit!
i would be worried about my rubber gaskets if i were to use it.--nbc

Brad White_200

Really? No lye?

Thanks, NBC! I knew I heard the term in other contexts... I guess that will ferret out errant aluminum and fuel a new energy source in the bargain.

At least both are alkali.

I will see about amending our specifications or at least clarifying them. Oy.