Off grid project -

Glen

well I queried the owner again - and while I misrepresented the numbers initially, he insists that its 2000 watts @ 12 mph. To date though the solar is keeping well ahead of all construction activities - I did stress it Tuesday when I filled the 1000 usg storage tanks. The deep well pump worked hard for 4 hours.

Glen

I am amazed -

at the performance of the PV panels and converter. As we near the end of this project - we have been doing our best to stress the elect system with the 300 and other lights/tools. I was suspicious at first - but the PV is not even breaking into a cold sweat. The wind mill is next - so between the two this home will have all the juice it needs. I have selected heating components with low elect draw, & even the deep well pump seems to have little effect on the battery condition during these days of high sun light. The heating system is 3500 sf of Roth panels, 1000 sf of slab, Greenwood boiler, 1000 gals of storage, heatlink mixing block/ODR controls. Depending on which zone calls for heat - total load of the heating system is about 350 - 400 watts.

hot_rod

makes you wonder if

a PV system has a better payback than a large thermal array. With a near consistent power useage all year around and net metering becoming more common

hr

jp_2

net metering vs batteries

I understand the sales pitch for net metering, but thats about it?

1.) the cost of batteries are far less than the cost of PV panels. with batteries, you are constantly storing what you do not use. roughly the amount of PV panels can be reduced by probably 40%.

2.) grid tie components are real expensive, not needed with a battery system.

3.) you are paying a lot of money for PV panels that you rarely use, average person is at work/school during peak production.

4.) power outages, here you spent a ton of money on a PV systems and if the grid goes down, you have no power when you need it the most, after sun down.

a better idea might be a dual system, grid for high power needs, shop ,kitchen freezers then PV system for lighting and bedrooms bathrooms.

I'd like to see some real numbers showing grid tie beneficial?

Glen

not sure -

but if a constant source of electricity is available with cooking and hot water handled by LPG - it looks like a winner.

jp_2

good point hot rod

last time I figured nat gas vs electricity costs per BTU, electricity was 4x the cost of gas.

so that can offset the higher cost of PV panels vs solar collectors. my PV panels work during snow storms.

Paul B_5

Glen : More info and possibly some pics of your PV system please . Im working a reply. Paul

Glen

pics tomorrow -

keep forgetting - something about hitting 55 :-)

Glen

pics -

yesterday was a bit hazy - and when I popped into the gen shack to take the pictures - it was pulling in 900 watts out of a total capacity of 3000. Still enough for the batteries and power needs of the site. As you can see - the home is on a ridge - so the wind power - if all goes to plan - will be the main source of dc for the batteries. The greenwood enclosure is not yet complete either. The utility quote - 6 years ago - was 50 000 plus to bring in the juice. From what I have seen - this fellow thoughtfully planned out his elect needs - and will be just fine - even in winter.

jp_2

how big

is the planned wind gen?

nice thing about solar, its pretty consistent.

wind is great, but often end up with many windless days.

nice to see off grid sites. thanks

Glen

wind gen -

is a whisper 200. Built in Phoenix I think.

Keith_8

windmill

How large is the windmill?

I was playing golf in Vermont a few weeks ago @ Haystack Mountain. My host pointed out several windmills on a ridge. I didn't even notice them. Probably because I was focusing on not losing anymore golf balls .

Anyway, he told me the neighbors have a court injunction against them and the owners are not allowed to harvest the energy and put it back onto the grid. Apparently they are ruining the ridge line. Not in my opinion.

The same weekend I was reading in the local paper that they local enviromental group was fighting the nuclear power companies attempt to extend the decomisioning of the plant.

It seems like we will all be freezing to death in the dark before this country gets real with a meaningful energy policy.


Keith

Glen

whisper

wind mill is 2000 watts at 5 mph. No neighbours to worry about as this fellow is tucked away high in the hills with only crown land (gov owned) surrounding him.

Wayco Wayne_2

Well said

I am reading all about the conflicts in energy policy. I am currently awaiting a ruling to put panels on my back roof. The Feral Gov put a hold on all Solar projects and then took it off. Ruining the ridge line, my butt. I bet they are beautiful. WW

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Paul B_5

Glen: The whisper 200 is the old southwest windpower H80, it is a 1000 watts MAX and the rating is ALWAYS at 28 mph ( NOT 2000 watt at 5 MPH)as you have stated., Thats Kinda why I had requested to see your pics a few posts back but have been too busy to reply as yet so I'll keep this short and reply later.. A FEW key points here. 1) Cheap turbines/windmills do not Last and therefore represent wastes dollars/poor overall value. 2) A good wind site test is in order for a proper power analysis based on the site/location 3) I personally know where theres about 15 of these 200's and 90% of them have been plagued with problems(mechanical) an/or poor overall performance. More comments to follow. Paul.. ( oh my background is 30 years industrial electrical and about 15 years of Off grid power system design/application. ) as I said I'll add more comment to some other stuff said in this thread next week. Ps. I Love that Array, nothing better than clean silent power that you produce on your own

Paul B_5

A quick reply to JP , next week I'll work you a nice reply to your preceeding post on Net metering vs. the grid tie/ battery based backup power system . Have a good weekend and stay tuned....Paul

Glen

I can only -

relay to you the hopes of the client; the stated specs are his, and to date - the array is keeping up with construction needs. The PV array was tested for one year in Ohio then moved to here to beautiful BC. This area enjoys lots of sun with very few days of inversion or overcast. And the wind generation just a few kms away is staggering - so I think he has chosen a good balance. The tower is ready to go - it will be tested soon. I will report later on its performance.
http://www.canhydro.com/projects/cowleyridgewind/

Paul B_5

Hi Glen . Put all the brakes on here !!! BEWARE of the good deals and overinflated production numbers here on ANY turbine here> The real numbers are posted in my Pic attached . the H-80/whisper 200 produces about 250 watts at 12 MPH. Maybee We or You are talking a differant Whisper turbine. Any LOW wind produces Little power to use and therefore most people are disappointed unless you have good wind ( your site indicates you probably do) . Anyway I'll try to get back to you as I hate to see anybody ripped off on any wind or RE system of false claims. Google the H-80s' on the net and youll' get your own/ or lack of base knowledge on the apples to apples on these machines. To convert the meters/second multiple the number on the left by 2.24 to equate it to MPH. More later Paul

Glen

we have googled!

came to the same conclusion as your chart suggests. It is set to be hoisted in the next week or so.