Water From Air Release Valves

Richard_26

This may sound like I know what I’m talking about – but I’m just learning – so go easy on me. I will provide as much (maybe too much) info as possible. We have a 3 family home. Our basement was redone about 15 years ago (well before I was with my wife). We have a steam system that uses gas, and we have been told because of some knocking, that we have some pitch problems producing water in the system. In the basement on the cold wall of the house is an air release valve. When the system runs we were getting water that spits out of this valve. This wouldn’t be too bad if this was an unfinished area. But we have to have a bucket catching water, and we have significant water damage. I recently tried replacing the valve. I was told to use a #1 “Air Eliminator” from Gorton. After replacing it, it still leaks. Looking at the Gorton Brochure, I noticed that multiple valves are sometimes recommended. I thought this might help the problem but wanted to check with Gorton. After calling in, I was told that there isn’t much I can do – especially that the system has water in it. After talking for a few minutes, it was suggested that I check the pressure on the “PresureTrol”. The PSI setting read about 10 PSI. (Although I was asked to check BOTH readings, the PressureTrol has only one meter on it). The gentleman told me that he ran his system at about one and a half or two PSI. He suggested that I lower mine down. I did, and found no different results. SLIGHTLY less knowcking, but still plenty of water. Adjusting it was pretty stright forward, but I'm hoping I did it correctly. There is a reset button on it, but I wasn’t sure if I needed to press it after adjusting the PSI. DO I - and are there spicific instructions like holding it down for any length of time?

I am hoping for and would appreciate some guidance. Am I really stuck with water spewing out of the release valve forever? What should the pressureTrol be set at and does it need to be reset? Lastly, is there ANYTHING that can be done to fix this problem, With my limited knowledge in this area, the only thing I can think of is fixing the pitch problem. I don’t think this is an option considering the expense besides messing up a newly fixed up basement. PLEASE HELP!!!

Thanks
Richard

don_185

You

You should set the pressure under 2 psi.that should give the condensate a chance to get back to the boiler.

I would be looking for clogged wet returns,very pitted pipes
and pitch of the pipe as well.

Maybe your best bet would be to look for someone that works with steam and have him come out to take a look.

nicholas bonham-carter

pressuretrol adjustment

i am sure you are not stuck with leaking vents for ever.
you should have 2 separate pressuretrols:
1 with the reset button for safety shut off in case the pressure goes above the set limit.when this happens you have to reset it to restart the boiler i keep my setting on this one at 3 PSI to protect the vents from over pressure damage.
2 the control pressuretrol which has no reset button [some models are called vaporstats]this one cycles the burner to keep the pressure between its operating limits so should be set cut in just above its lowest point and cut out no higher than 1.5 psi [my vaporstat is set to cut in at2OZ. and cut out at 12 OZ.]
if you have a good 6 in. level with a magnetic groove in it you can check the pitch of your return pipes to check for sags where water can not drain out back to the boiler
other things to check--if you have an auto-fill is it over filling?
is your water clean and oil free? does the waterline jump around a lot when firing?
is the leaking vent mounted at least 6 in. above the pipe and 15 in. from any elbow or tee?
hope this helps it took me a while to get my system running right.
just remember to find a knowlegeable steam pro for whom YOU will be the eyes and ears and he may be able to show you how to do those jobs you can do yourself.--nbc

Richard_26

Thank you Nicholas and Don for your responses I received to date. I truly appreciate your helpful information.

As I said I am a beginner at heating, but very willing to learn. Don, you mentioned that I should have two pressuretrols. After reading your responses, I took another look at our system. I guess I did over look that. It seems that we do have 2 separate gauges. One is actually labeled “HIGH PRESURE” – (the one with a reset button on it) and that one is the Honeywell PresureTrol. I mistakenly mentioned that I set it to 2PSI. I was incorrect. I actually set it to 5PSI. The other is labeled “LOW PRESURE” and has the company name of “White Rodgers” on it. The (White Rodgers) Low Pressure control (which I have never adjusted) is set to a hair under 1. This gauge does not indicate ounces or psi anywhere on it. WHICH OF THE 2 SETTINGS IS ACTUALLY CREATING THE PROBLEM? There is also a a gauge that I believe shows the actual operating pressure. I will be keeping an eye on this one!

Just to make sure I understand – (PLEASE correct me if I’m wrong) I should re-adjust to approximately the following settings:
• High Pressure (Honeywell PressureTrol) - reset to 3 psi. Would my setting of 5 psi actually create a problem?
• Low Pressure (White Rodgers) - Already set to 1. (Should this be lowered given my situation?)
We do NOT have an automatic water feed. And when we add water, it never bounces inside the glass window. The water does get a bit rusty looking from time to time. When it does we remove it, and replace with fresh water.

With regard to examining the pitch on the pipes, being that the basement is finished, this is nearly impossible without tearing down the walls. As far as I can tell the line runs just under 6 feet from the floor and has 2 elbows just before the valve. The first in the line is at least six inches from the next, while the one just before the valve is exactly 6 inches from it.

At this point I am waiting to check the results of my readjustments. Call me a pessimist, but the adjustments are fairly minor considering where they last were. Should I be correct in assuming that this is no longer a “Do it Yourself” project if these adjustments don’t remedy the problem? I am trying to stay away from spending the big $$$ unless totally necessary.

Once again thanks again for your help Don and Nicholas, and to anyone else that is nice enough to write back.

Richard.

nicholas bonham-carter

leaking vents

high pressure pressuretrol should be set at 3 psi[no harm done set to 5psi]
low pressure set to under 1 psi [but i am not familiar with the white rogers pressuretrol so maybe someone else can fill in my missing info on that.]
i suggest you buy a low pressure gauge from the gaugestore.com--mine reads 0 to 3 psi so you can see the actual pressure in the system,as the code required 0--30 psi gauge is useless for that range of pressure measurement.mine was a very worthwhile $30-40.
one thing can happen which will allow the pressuretrols to be inaccurate is a clogged pipe [pigtail ]they would be connected to the boiler with--if they can't feel the pressure they will allow over pressure to occur.
you may be able to measure the pitch of the return by screwing in a length of pipe where the vent is and measuring that angle.
lastly get yourself a copy of dan's book on this site THE LOST ART OF STEAM HEATING--again money well-spent.
when you have solved all of these problems you will have a nice warm feeling from the accomplishment AND THE STEAM!!
GOOD LUCK NBC