DROPPING THE IGNITION OUT

realolman

often wondered the same thing.

Exactly the same situation here. we used to run the ignition continuously, but in the last maybe 10-15 years we had to change over to intermittant... it think 30 seconds, but I don't remember for sure. I think somehow the insurance company wanted it.

How is that safer?

Toddid Goldsmith's

DROPPING THE IGNITION OUT

I'VE HEARD ALL KINDS OF REASONS, WHAT DO YOU GUY"S THINK? YEARS AGO WITH THE STACK RELAYS RA-117'S FOR EXAMPLE, THEY HAD A RELAY FOR THE MOTOR, AND A RELAY FOR THE IGNITION.AS TIME WENT ON WE USED CONTROLS THAT KEPT THE TRANSFORMERS ON DURING A RUN RA-8184 FOR EXAMPLE. NOW WE ARE DROPPING THE IGNITION BACK OUT, AFTER PROOF OF IGNITION,HONEYWELLS 7184'S FOR EXAMPLE.I HEARD A LOT OF DIFFERENT IDEAS, WHAT DO YOU GUY'S THINK?

Leo

I think

I think you should stop using all CAPS. Internet etiquette says all caps is yelling.

To your question, it saves electricity, transformers/igniters, electrodes and helps prevent running saturations and soot ups. It was once thought constant (intermittant) ignition helped prevent flame outs but all it did was mask other problems.

Leo

Toddid Goldsmith's

Sorry

Sorry about the caps Leo. I'm kind of new at this internet thing. One of the guy's at work today explained to me, that when you use all caps, that means you are yelling.Now I know why people I e-mail, ask me why I'm yelling all the time.I'm a little slow, but I'll get there.Thanks and again I'm sorry.

Leo

Hey Todd

The internet is a whole different culture. All caps is actually harder to read especially as the eyes get older and need reading glasses like mine. (this symbol means a smile)

Leo

Toddid Goldsmith's

HEY LEO!!!

HOW THAT???

bill nye_3

Maybe

Maybe it was cheaper to make the 8184G. One less set of contacts in the relay?

mtfallsmikey

Ignition

Went back to intermittent with the advent of solid-state ignitors, transformers could be left powered up without damage.

Bob Bona_4

makes sense

to me.

Hate to be a stickler, but I think the term is "interupted" ignition for today's controls. I dimly remember in burner school talking about it. Could be wrong

Chas_4

Dropping out the ignition at the end of TFI helps prevent running saturations. In a situation with a partially plugged nozzle the ignition can sustain a poor fire which leads to a buildup of unburned oil-soaked crap. When that ignites it makes a hot uncontrolled fire, possibly up into the chimney. Without the ignitor powered the burner will lock out.

Hopefully the homeowner doesn't keep pushing the reset.

[Deleted User]

Most interrupted

ignition cad cell relays have a "3 strikes-yer out" feature to reduce HO button pushing problem.

Interrupted ignition offers many advantages.

Cuts down on running saturations.
Extends electrode life.
Extends ignition transformer (ignitor) life.
Reduces retention head carbon fouling.
Reduces NOX emissions.
Reduces electric consumption.
Quieter burner operation.

What's not to like? Oh, yeah. Relay(s) cost a few dollars more than the alternative.

Marilyn_4

intermittent

According to the teachings of NORA, the newest terms for ignition are;
Constant: always on, such as a pilot light.
Intermittent: is on when burner is on.
Interrupted: Goes on for a period of time then shuts off while the burner continues to run.

These new terms have some of the more experienced in the field confused, but that is how the newest material refers to ignitions.

Concerning the smiley face...you forgot the nose ;>)
(notice the winking eye?)

Marilyn

Bob Bona_4

it goes back

futher than you think:)
Wayy back in 92, in CT's ICPA, when RA117 stack relays were still around here and there, the subject of interrupted vs. intermittent was bandied about. You could go either way with them. I think it was even on some test! I have a silly mind game to keep those terms straight..

Charlie Masone

7184A relays are less than 8184G relays, why would you use the 8184G?

J.C.A._3

Bob G....

"because...that's the way we've always done it" seems to be the only answer I can come up with.

Ignorance is bliss. There are a lot of folks still trying to achieve Nirvana...apparently. Chris

Toddid Goldsmith's

Three Elements

fuel,air.& igntion right?

realolman

What I was talking about

was a larger (14 Mbtu ) gas burner.

It seems to me it might be safer to allow the ignition and the pilots to remain on. I can see where that might hide some problem with the main flame, but it seems to me it would be safer.

mtfallsmikey

And...

You can do some "tricks" with the 8184 that can't be done with the 7184...plus no need to remember how to take it out of lockout...The term "intermittent" ignition was the the one I was raised on..RA117 could be set up eiether way..Bob Bona: remember the look on a HO's face when you reset the contacts on one and the burner magically sprung into life?...(geez alert!)..BTW, who made the aftermarket diagnosic tool that plugs into the 7184, and is Honeywell making one now.

Bob Bona_4

\"putting it in step\"

Mikey...pull those contacts out and release slowly. And say a prayer it will work after you leave

Chas_4

OnWatch offers the Quick Look 72 and Honeywell has the Diagnostick QS7100T. Haven't actually used either but from pictures they appear to be the same product. OnWatch has online software upgrades for their products