No Hartford Loop ?

Phil_17

The Hartford loop was designed as a check valve to protect the boiler incase there was a leak in the wet return of the boiler piping.The counterflow steam system has no wet return
therefore a Hartford loop is not needed.

Unknown

No Hartford Loop ?

I was having a very regular conversation with a fellow plumber talking shop about how we pipe steam boilers.
Now I've read almost every book you can buy from this site.
I've learned a lot from the wall also. Now I put double-drop-headers on every job and things go smooth.

I thought this guy was joking, but he was serious. He claimed you didn't need a hartford loop on some gravity systems. My jaw hit the floor & I laughed.
Has anyone ever heard of such a joke ?
I have not.

He even claims that a boiler would pass an inspection without one. In NJ the codes are based on doing things to manufacturers specs.
I don't know about you. I wouldn't press my seal on that permit.

tbuck

hartford loop

There are guys in my area that say that too. I find they don't understand that the Hartford Loop does 3 things:
equalze pressure between supply and return (keeps water in the boiler when steaming or in case of a leak...kinda important and the reason that Hartford advocated it probably).
Provides a drain for the external near boiler pipng.
and helps assure "dry steam" to the system.

A certain amount of corner cutting is understadable these days. People with no job or working 2 bad jobs makes hiring the high bidder unattractive but for an installer to leave the Hartford Loop out of a steam job...it's only a few feet of pipe, some elbows, and a tee.

I do not get it.

tbuck

hartford loop

There are guys in my area that say that too. I find they don't understand that the Hartford Loop does 3 things:
equalze pressure between supply and return (keeps water in the boiler when steaming or in case of a leak...kinda important and the reason that Hartford advocated it probably).
Provides a drain for the external near boiler pipng.
and helps assure "dry steam" to the system.

A certain amount of corner cutting is understadable these days. People with no job or working 2 bad jobs makes hiring the high bidder unattractive but for an installer to leave the Hartford Loop out of a steam job...it's only a few feet of pipe, some elbows, and a tee.

I do not get it.

Unknown

I don't know how someone can advocate no hartford loop when it's in all boiler "recommended" pipe schematics period.
Maybe they get mixed up in that it's only "recommened."
I guess they think," just because it's recommened doesn't mean I have to." Perhaps that's the loop hole that allows it to pass inspection.

bill_97

What about

if the system has dry returns ? We come across that from time to time , and always pipe in a HL . But is it really needed with dry returns ? But whether a HL is piped in or not , like tbuck said , an equalizer is a must for the reason he stated .

DanHolohan

My thoughts:

Nowadays, you have to pipe a steam boiler for what it needs to make dry steam. That's going to include a header-drip/equalizer. I think that no matter how the job is piped, be it wet-return, dry-return, or counterflow, the pipe that brings the condensate back to the boiler is best served if it enters the header-drip/equalizer though a Hartford Loop. Without it, steam can work its way back up the return when the boiler's waterline drops during a steaming cycle. Can't happen if you use the loop and it's good cheap insurance against potential problems.

Unknown

I went back to my books i.e. Lindhardts Field Guide & The Lost Art. Both show counterflow systems without hartford loops. I guess that not using a H.L. can go in the " The way we were" catagory.

So realy the only difference between counter-flow & parrallel is where you connect to the main.

A counter flow ties into a supply main from above righ @ the lowest end.

A parrallel ties directly into the main coming up from the boiler.