One pipe piping mess - fix or start over

JBee_3

When it is fixed could you send in some more photos thanx

Gary Segal

One pipe piping adventure - did the dead men do it?

My brother in law just bought this 2-story house in DC with one pipe steam. As you might expect from the pictures, he is suffering from uneven heating (some radiators never get hot, noise, high fuel bills and, of course a very warm basement!

So here are my questions:

1. Best recommendation for fixing the near boiler piping. Can it work without starting over from scratch?

2. Can this system work effectively with all the 90 degree take-offs?

3. I can see there is a need for lots of venting in the mains (none at the moment). As expected, the radiators hiss up a storm. Would the best solution be to drill and tap into the mains a foot back from the wet returns?

4. Can you tell the purpose of the 1" pipe on the front of the boiler with the brass shut-off valve?

5. Does a boiler with these cutoff and fill devices need to be blown down periodically?

Thanks,

Gary

gerry gill

it

will never work right until the flaws are corrected..the pipe with the valve is the gas pipe unless your talking about something else.

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Tom Hopkins

of course

it's the gas line. I've lived with oil for so long, the concept of a gas line never occurred to me!

Thanks!

Steamhead (in transit)

Biggest problems I see

are lack of insulation, lack of main vents and wrong near-boiler piping.

The first two will be easy to correct. The third would depend on whether that boiler requires one or two risers to the header- you didn't get the model number, did you?

The 90° takeoffs aren't that bad, the one with all the elbows looks like it might be some sort of expansion loop.

Regardless, if he's in the DC area he should call Dan Foley at Foley Mechanical. They're in Find a Professional.

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Tom Hopkins

maybe next year before it's fixed ....

It's my brother-in-law's place .... they just bought it in the fall... home inspecter said heating system was in great shape ... fixed up the rest of the house and now the money tree is pretty wilted. When I first saw it, I was hoping at first that a little insulation and some vents would get it healthy until I got a good look at the near-boiler piping.

Gary

Steamhead (in transit)

Well, those two items

are easily fixed and will definitely help matters. I'd have them done first, and as soon as possible.

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scottie_3

another problem

From looking at your left main takeoff 3 pic, you also have some wiring issues to deal with. Wires passing THRU floor joists (holes drilled with wire passing inside it) and across (perpendicular) floor joists need to be corrected. The first one weakens the joist, and the second allows people to hang things from the wire, a no-no. Either condition is a violation of the electrical code.
FYI
Good luck

David Nadle

Are you sure?

I was under the impression it was OK to run cable through a joist provided that the hole is more than 1-1/4" from the edge or a nailplate is installed to protect the cable.

I agree that that's a lot of holes drilled in one spot...

jp_2

i question that too?

how can you run wire across the basement if you can not run wire perpendicular to the joist?

as far as weakening the joist, guess its too late, holes are there.

scrook_2

wires across joists

easiest is to use 1x3 or 1x4 strapping under and staple wire along it. EMT (thinwall) tubing instead of NM/romex is also an option.

scrook_2

wires across joists

easiest is to use 1x3 or 1x4 strapping under the joist and staple the wire along it. EMT (thinwall) tubing instead of NM/romex is also an option: tidy, but more work.

Gary Segal

holes in joist

Thanks for pointing out this issue. I suspect that there may be more issues down there.

These particular holes are either in violation or close to it. The NEC states:

"Holes bored in joists shall not be within 2 inches of the top or bottom of the joist, and the diameter of any such hole shall not exceed 1/3 the depth of the joist."

If I understand the code correctly, assuming that the joists are 2" thick, the maximum hole diameter would be approximately 5/8".

I'll check it out next time I am in the house,, but as jp noted, the holes are already there.

Gary

scottie_3

Sorry for the confusion. I am very glad you are looking into the NEC, that's the place to go for electrical code. But what you may be confusing is exposed wiring vs hidden wiring (like inside a wall). Its ok to route wiring through joists (following code) if hidden. But in a basement, it is exposed. You can run wiring in EMT tubing to protect it and run it across joists. Or you can screw in a flat piece of wood across the joists and then lay the wire across that. Scrook mentions these methods in his post above. Or you can route it around the foundation where the wood meets the concrete to the joist where the fixture is. That method uses more wire though. When I get home from work I can post pics if you can't visualize my poor descriptions.