ci rad connections

Eric Johnson

Thanks for all your help. I learned a few new things about ci rads.

Attached are some pics of how the rehab went. Not much to it, but moving it from the garage into the greenhouse alone was an interesting challenge. That's half the fun. The other half was discovering the lion head cast into the design on the columns. Most old rads have flowers and other somewhat feminine designs, but this is a man's radiant heat.

I know you're not supposed to mix baseboard and cast iron radiators, but this is a greenhouse, so I hope you'll cut me some slack.

Eric Johnson

ci rad connections

I've got a couple of cast iron radiators with those nickle-plated brass union-type pressure connections. Since they're going into a greenhouse, I want to take the brass connectors out of the tappings and just run straight copper in and out of the rads. No valves, in other words.

At first I couldn't figure out how they were screwed in in the first place, but then I noticed the little keys cast into the inlets, which I assume requires a special tool.

Any idea where I'd find a tool like that? Or, maybe better yet, short of getting valves, is there a standard fitting (half of a union, maybe) that I can use to connect them to my system?

bruce_21

You want a radiator spud wrench. Many supply houses should have them. Start soaking the threads with PB Blaster, Free-All, or WD-40 now.

rob brown

spuds

i've never been able to remove spuds with the spud wrench.spud wrenches are for installing spuds, try to remove them and you will just shear those nubs right off.i've always cut the nut off with a sharp cold chisel then twist the spud out with your pipe wrench. rob

Eric Johnson

me too

The last one I tried, the pipe wrench didn't even work. The brass is so soft that it just collapsed under the force. At that point, you're down to a sawzall and a hacksaw blade. I like to do most of the cutting with the sawzall, then finish it off with the blade. You can feel when you hit the cast iron threads, then go to work with the cold chisel.

I hate to destroy a set of perfectly good pressure connections. The ones I have are inch and a quarter, so maybe I'll save myself the grief and just figure out a way to make them work.

Thanks for the info. I should pick up a spud wrench anyway, since I like to fool around with old radiators.

Timco

I like to cut the union nut off with a buzz grinder, then put the spud wrench in the nipple and then use the wrench...the brass does not collapse with the spud wrench in it...usually. ME said it best...use 'surprise torque', not gradual pressure.

Tim

ralman

I just went through this trouble.

I could not locate a tool to purchase. I have 3/4 inch valves. I took a spare 13MM 3/8 drive deepwell socket and cut two notches in the side of the socket with a 4.5 inch grinder and cutoff wheel. I used the 13MM socket because it fit tight in the spud. I consider myself lucky, the spuds backed out with no trouble.

Ken_40

There are at least two styles...

of spud wrench/tool.

One's cut from ~1/4" flat stock and simply has "steps" - these are the ones that fit a bit too loose, and typically will strip the brass ears off the spud - making the job a real PITA.

The other one is a casting (similar to a chubby carrot) that is stepped, but cylindrical with the notches of engagement snug as hell. These are much improved with regard to functionality, but still never 100% effective.

If you cut off the nut and grab the stub, be sure to "buck up" the inside of the stub - so the jaws of your pipe wrench don't collapse the O.D.! If all elase failes, filleting the brass from c.i. - as described above, always works. The time and care involved however makes simply replacing the rad almost as viable, T&M-wise.

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Daniel_3

Even when the nipple's OD warps you can still remove it. I've done it many times with a 2 footer. Some with a spud wrench twist right out (water rads) and some times you must use the wrench and if all else fails, then the buzz and a cold chisel. All the above will work.

Eric Johnson

Shock and Awe

"Surprise Force" worked without the benefit of a spud. The hard part was cutting off the union nuts with a SawZall because they wouldn't stay put. A 24-inch pipe wrench did the rest. It's an old water radiator, so that might have been a contributing factor. The last one I tried was a steamer. An old one--so old it doesn't have a top pipe.

And it pressured right up. I was a little concerned putting in the black iron reducer bushings that something might crack. Is there a set of guidelines that tells you how big a wrench to use on fittings of a given size, or is that just knowledge acquired through experience? I cracked a 1-inch black iron fitting on a recent project, and was surprised. Bummed, too.

Daniel_21

My guess is your fitting was malleable black iron and made in China. These are not known for quality casting techniques as I have experienced as well. Too much torque and it will crack. When using such it is best to use lots of tape and dope and go easy on it. It's now easier to remove and works like it's supposed to. That being said I wouldn't put a 2 footer on a 1 inch iron fitting and lean on it.

I used a rotozip with he metal attachment and held the union nut in place below while I cut across the top. I did the same to the other side and there you have it.

Capt Jack

You guys are great!!!

I had a similar problem with my radiators and the spuds not coming out. After reading this I succeeded in removing one of them. I'm sure the others will come out just as slick. I used the Grinding of the Socket Method along with penetrating oil and at first, it broke the one fin inside the spud. So I then left the socket inside the spud and persuded it with a large pipe wrench along with a good swift thump on the wrench with a large rubber mallet and poof. Out she came. Yes, I am an idiot. I tried to combine slant fins with the cast iron and trust me...it does not work! Lesson learned at minimal expense but I should have known better. Now I will only slant fins on a seperate zone in the attic or basement. I'm assuming that will work but your feed back is welcomed if you might foresee any problems. Thanks again!

Dave_4

I bought the spud wrench - it's stepped as you describe (1/2" to 2") but doesn't really fit snuggly into the 1/2" ell union and 3/4" valve unions I've purchased to replace the existing traps and valves (switching from 2 pipe steam to water). I did put the spud wrench into one of the unions on a radiator - it went in after I gave it a little 'push' with a hammer. So my question is, "will I be able to put enough torque on the spuds even though the fit is loose or should I try to find a different spud wrench?"