Low Loss header

Lyle C

Hot Rod Thanks
I'm using a external tankless made without the coil and with extra tappings. Thats why the reason for the 12" diamater . The price they quoted me is about a quarter the price of a regular 2" LLH. Steve ,the engineer on this project say's ASME rating is not needed but of course I'll check with the AHJ.

Lyle C

DYI Low Loss Header

I have a project coming up that a lowloss header will be perfect for . I know some of you have built your owm LLH's,
any rules ? I read at one point the diameter should be 3 times the pipe size. Any other rules ? Can the connections be at 90 degrees from each other instead of 180 if the diameter is larger?
Thanks

hr

Yes

the barrel should be 3 times the diameter of the branch pipe size. Factory built ones have a screen in the top portion to collect air bubbles. Not unlike the Spiro and other micro bubble resorbers.

I don't think a 90 offfset would matter. I've piped P/S take-offs that way without a problem.

When you add the cost and labor involved to build one, the Caleffi doesn't look too expensive Unless you need a non ferrous.

Php offers copper separators now, and Watts.

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Paul Rohrs_4

DYI = \"Do Yourself In\"

Couldn't resist today.

Regards,

PR

John F

PHP now offers a full line of hydraulic separators. If you are going to REX, we will have all of them on display. If you want more info, please contact me directly at 503-209-7830 or via email at johnf@phpinc.us.

Lyle C

DYI

Hot Rod . I had spoken to a local manufacter about building a LLH using one of their copper insulated shells. Very reasonable for 4-2" tappings with 3/4" top tapping for vent and 2" bottom tapping for mud leg . But the problem is the 12" diameter X 20" long tank I think it should work at the 90 degree. It may become a combination LLH and buffer tank. Thanks for your input.

Steve Ebels_3

Code problems lurking

I heard of a job that was turned down because the LLH was "field fabricated" and therefore not ASME rated. To me, that seems a little far fetched for a system with a 30PSI relief valve but from what I could ascertain, it's true. Check with your loco, I mean local, AHJ.

Weezbo

that dose does not sound correct.

there are quite a few types and configurations of low loss headers,...if it is constructed out of sound materials we use everyday,.... how could there be a need for an asme rating?

are headers considered in need of an ASME rating and certification? not that it would be a surprise considering the out sourcing of the overburdening governmental bureaucrats to some place like India where the British taught them everything in the world about multi level governmental paper shoveling.*~/:)


too bad they don't hire the yogi's on ... to get the lot of them into a transcendental state .... move there, and leave us alone:)


now that would be the ticket, the state where AHJ's go to nit pick each other, eternally

seems far from realistic to require the chubby header to have some special rating....did they site the page chapter paragraph where we might see how this is being misconstrued?

hr

12\" diameter copper?

wow, sounds expensive? I built a copper one with a piece of 4", reducing couplings on top and bottom, and a T-Drill for the 1" connections.

I'm sure schedule 40 steel pipe with fittings would work also.

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Nron_13

New line of low loss headers

take a look at this web site http://www.sinusverteiler.de/index.php?id=38&L=1#oben
nice headers at a resonable price

Steve Ebels_3

In the USSR of MI

In the United Soviet Socialist Republic of Michigan, a commercial boiler install requires a mechanical inspection for system piping and then a boiler inspection for the boiler itself. On the install I was referring to, the boiler inspector was the one who raised the ASME question regarding the LLH. His logic was that it should be rated the same as an ASME expansion tank because it is in effect, a pressure vessel. Never heard how it actually turned out.

hr

Do any LLH's have ASME listings?

I don't see that indicated in any Caleffi or PHP ads? Do air purgers require ASME? I've not seen that on any I install.

To my way of thinking a "homemade LLH or hydro separator is no different than a homemade or site built primary secondary piping loop. We don't need ASME on the pipe and fittings to build P/S loops, why should we on a copper tube separator.

But it may be best to check with the AHJ that will be looking at it.

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Glen

another view

I was once queried by a boiler inspector re the cert for that nice cast fitting on top of so many viessmann boilers. The cert for that is included in the boiler CRN documents (H stamp). By extension but not specifically endorsed the same cert is offered to their LLH's. But only if used in conjunction with a Viessmann product - although it has already been discovered that the applications far exceed original purpose. Technically the device is a fitting. Mill certs would apply if an ASME project as specified in the quality control manual of the project. Sounds like the gent had a bad morning ......

scott markle_2

LLH

I'm planing to remove the LLH I have installed with my vitodens in favor of a direct connected system. Flow rates on system side don't justify it's use. I was pushed to incorporate it by a sales rep. who implied it was esential to a radiant application, but now feel it does nothing except keep another circulator running and dilute my high delta return water.

I would love to find a home for it though. If you would rather recycle mine than build one give me a call

845-687-9872

Lyle C

LLC

Thanks Scott, I appricate the offer . But if this project flies I'll have 4 systems to set up the same way. I'll know for sure by the end of the week whats going on with this.