New Coil or New Boiler or Repair?

Bill Pidgeon_2

Thanks.

So is there a default boiler that most agree is the best fit in a Levitt house? The original hangs in a recess next to the fireplace in the kitchen. How about a Munchkin? How is the domestic hot water handled? As you probably know, not much room for a water heater and the slab isn't friendly to adding new pipes.

Thanks again.

Bill

Bill Pidgeon_2

New Coil or New Boiler or Repair? Levittown Radiant

Do my parents need a new hot water coil or a new boiler or some other repair.

My 80+ parents live in Levittown and have a service contract on their heating system with the same company that delivers their oil. It's the old General Electric with a Becket burner, that Ron, Jr. has posted pics of his artistic replacements in impossible spaces.

The problem is the domestic hot water doesn't stay warm long enough to get through a shower. They have a good low flow shower head, but the water turns cool in less than 5 minutes with no additional hot water demands.

They asked their contractor about replacing the hot water coil and were told that the coil can't be replaced. They have no problems heating the house - the problem is limited to the domestic hot water, from their point of view.

I was there this past weekend and found that the burner will turn on and only stay on for 130 to 140 seconds, when hot water is not flowing.

I watched the boiler thermometer, and the boiler turned on at 135 degrees and shut off at 140 degrees. There are two limit switches, and one is set at 160 degrees and the other is set at 180 degrees.

Since I have no idea of the burner flow rate, nor the gallons of water in the boiler, I can't estimate if the 20 degree rise is actually happening in 130 to 140 seconds per the limit switches, or only a 5 degree rise per the thermometer.

So, I'm concerned that it may be short cycling, but my parents have no awareness of this issue, and since there was no hot water flow when I timed it, maybe 140 seconds is reasonable.

Back to the hot water coil - I remember they had it cleaned when I was a kid (over 40 years ago). The two technicians brought in an air compressor and it made a big impression on me. I remember they turned on the tub faucet and an impressive amount of stuff came out. And the showers were much warmer afterward. They had it cleaned a number of times since. The last cleaning was about a year ago, and it helped, but only for a short time. Maybe I need a referral to someone that will do a more thorough cleaning?

So, can the hot water coil be replaced, or do they really need a new boiler? Also, I tried to talk my Father into getting a mixing valve, because the technicians set the boiler temperature so high that it is easy to get scalded, but he wouldn't agree to it last year. This year he seems a little more open to it. Don't Levitt houses have mixing valves?

Oh, I just remembered that I measured the water temperature at the kitchen faucet and it peaked at 138 degrees at low flow, then quickly started dropping even at low flow. So maybe the boiler thermometer is correct. But both limit switches being inaccurate doesn't seem reasonable and they looked fairly new - they are Honeywells.

Sorry for rambling - I'll be grateful for any advice.

Bill Pidgeon

Unknown

I think

I think I heard Dan's car started up and on the way to ur folk's place to write another great story on this. There's many good heating pros from this site are willing to help...

Robert O'Brien

The

coil can't be replaced.After almost 60 years it's time for a boiler.

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Robert O'Brien

No gas

You're pretty much locked into a oil boiler/coil.I believe the W/Mc GO3 is the best fit.

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Bill Pidgeon_2

Thanks for the advice and quick response. Back to work...

Unknown

Hi Bill

Thanks for the compliment in the original post . Are your parents original owners ?

One of our crews was changing out a GE today . This has been the year of the GE - maybe 2 a week are being upgraded . Sadly , I don't believe they make a replacement coil for that type GE anymore . More often than not the coil plate and the stud and nuts that hold it in are far too gone to try and attempt it . One of my coworkers was around for the days when they'd replace the coil . It actually wraps around inside the boiler , you have to spin it in like you're making a long left turn with your car . And everything had to be dismantled on top to do the job . At today's prices it's a much better investment to put that money towards a new system .

Your parent actually have a few choices . The boiler can be replaced and put back on the shelf . Our brand is the Weil Mclain Gold 3L , special built for these homes . It fits back under the cover too . Another choice is replacing the GE with a boiler on the floor in the same area . You can put basically any cast iron or steel one pass boiler there . The downside is that you lose alot of room to walk from the kitchen to the bathroom and back bedrooms . And the cover won't work anymore . But ..... with both these options the coil is usually good for 2 bathrooms . All bets are off though if 2 showers are going at once .

The best choice ( and the most expensive ) is to move the boiler to the garage or back room . Doing that , you have your choice of systems - oil , gas , anything that will fit in the space you set aside for the equipment . We average maybe 1 relocation every month in Levitt homes . Homeowners love not hearing the burner noise in the kitchen . Some even knock down the chimney and open up the kitchen living room area . Does your parents have Meenan as their service company ? Here's a GE replacement me and Sal installed back in July .

Bill Pidgeon_2

> Are your parents original owners ?
Almost, they bought it in 1954.
>


Thanks for all the info on the coil and the boiler options. I emailed this thread to them, and I'll call them tomorrow to get their reaction.



If the WM 3L coil gets limed, can it be cleaned or replaced at reasonable cost? Does the Meenan service contract cover the cost of cleaning or replacing the coil? By the way, they only have one bathroom, which they regret when I show up with my 4 kids.

They do not have a contract with Meenan, but my Dad is not happy with the new foreman, so he will be changing.

Are the floor-standing boilers, which you seem to favor, more efficient, or just more capacity? They had insulation blown into the walls, so I don't think they need more capacity. But if they are more efficient, the lower fuel costs may justify a higher initial price.

Thanks again for all the info, it's very helpful.

Bill

Steamhead (in transit)

If I were your parents

I'd switch to Meenan just to get Ron Jr. and his merry men to replace that boiler.

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Bill Pidgeon_2

Thanks Steamhead. There is no doubt about Ron Jr.'s workmanship, knowledge, & experience. I wonder if their front office is as good. My Dad's generous & good as gold till you cross him. If he calls over there and gets someone who's rude or a b/s artist... Old Marines don't seem to lose their fire, which is good.

Bill