USA' s Greatest Engineer..........

jp_2

so you are sitting there on your laptop which weighs the same as a 10 meg hard drive did in the 80's, talking to the office on your free cell phone that cost $1,200.00 back in the 80's

your truck has 100,000 miles on it with orginal spark plugs which always starts on the first crank, you rave about the viessmann and munchkin, controls and such......

and what about that 'cool' miltary hardware from dessert storm, or the atomic bomb? did that all come about from a plumber tinkering in his garage?

so you are surrounded by ALL this technology which has been engineered, but you bash engineers.....

if you've never been to college, you have NO idea the wealth of knowledge you could collect and use. bashing college really makes someone look truely ignorant or more likely, envious.

ed. everyone has their place, good and bad people in every field one can imagine, bashing a 'field' is just plain dumb!

John Ruhnke

My latest book....

Hi Everyone,

I am reading a new book about who I consider USA's greatest engineer, Henry Ford. The name of the book is the Peoples Tycoon. I have only read the first two chapters.

Already I am mad at society. Who was this great Engineer? He invented the assembly line and made the automobile available to everyone. The assembly line was so efficient that he was able to pay his employees twice the going rate and still make huge profits. What was his background? Did he learn his craft at the best colleges in America?

NO!!!!!!!!!!

He was a trades person just like me. He served an apprenticeship at three machine and repair shops. The first machine shop he made steam valves and fittings. Yes he built parts for the Steamfitting trade. The second job was at a ship building company. He built engines. The third was a watch repair shop. He repaired watches and clocks.

I am mad and I feel this country has been cheated out of my abilities for years now!! I am not allowed to call my design work engineered work. When I was in high school I was brainwashed and influenced by society to think that the trades were a second choice after college. Trades people like the Wright Bros, Henry Ford and Thomas Edison built this country. This country was built by mechanical and electrical trades people. This country was great when technology was lead by these trades people.

I am mad and I am not going to take this #$%&@# anymore!!
The state of Connecticut says that I am misrepresenting mmyself if I call myself an Engineer!!

I say I am MISREPRESNTING MYSELF BY NOT CALLING MYSELF AN ENGINEER. They have held my abilities back!! If I had any time or money on my hands I would fight this in legal court!!!!!

We will fight this #$%&*$#@ on our own home court. I don't care what you call me. I am going to prove that trades people make the best engineers. From now on I consider myself an Engineer and I will act accordingly. I will make heating systems more efficient. I will find a way to get the DOE to pay for my grant work. We are going to do things the right way. AFUE will be history when I get through with it. WE are going to measure heating systems the right way. We are going to build heating controls and boilers the right way. I am tired of hearing how good the Europeans are.

We are going to take matters into our own hands and make this country great again!!!!!!

A simple trades person,

John Ruhnke
JR@ComfortableHeat.com

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

phil_18

Henry Ford would never let the world hold him back.
Even the Garbage man is a Sanitation Engineer.

[Deleted User]

John...

This is not the first time you've raised your hackles over this title thing. I for one, do not understand your obsession with the title "engineer".

I have all the respect in the world for you and what you do and what you've accomplished to this point without the title "engineer".

What more are you going to be able to do that you are doing right now if you are allowed to call yourself an "engineer"?

Will you be able to work faster?

Will you be able to work more efficiently?

Will you be better at doing matmatical equations?

Will you be able to make more money?

Will you be able to spend more time with your family?

I suspect the answer to all of these questions is NO.

I guess I don't understand your obsession. Maybe you need to seek help so you can get over this hurdle and move on and continue to be productive.

To be quite frank with you, most of the engineers I've met do not impress me, because they have never had the challenge of putting five pounds of system into a 2 pound bag. They may have a decent handle on the theoretical side of things, but they lose it there. I suspect that if a psycologist were to interview them, they would find that these people envy the "trades" for their inherent skills and abilities that exceed common man.

With the rare exceptions of the few Brad Whites kicking about out there, most engineers have little to no manual dexterity skills. And THAT is what I would consider a travesty. Not the ability to title yourself "engineer".

Get over it, move on and remain productive. All of the good things in life are at your avail. Use them to advance yourself and skip the moniker.

Just one non engineer MASTER trades persons point of view...

ME

John Ruhnke

I was damaged by the system in my early years.....

Hey Everyone,

Everything in my life now makes sense.

Chapter three of my book. Henry Ford goes to work for Edison. There they discover his emense talents. After doing very well for a couple of years he finally meets the man at the top, Edison. Edison congratulates Ford on the fine gas powered car that he built. Ford built this car in his own free time. Though he did use shop space and tools found in Edisons shops. Edison never cared. He seemed to be happy with Ford. Edison and Ford continued to talk on other days and became great friends!!

Edison was the electrical genius of his time and the younger Ford went on to become a great mechanical genius. If it wasn't for Edison I don't think Ford would have developed such great confidence. Neither one of the two learned there craft in college. They were both trades people!!

I was born to build. Society tried to hold me back in my life. They call my problems ADD, Attention Deficit disorder. THat is all a bunch of #$%&%$!! I don't have any disorders!! I was born to build not toil behind a desk!! I am not the one with the disorders. They say Edison and Ford had the same ADD stuf I have. They have this inner driven motor that won't let them sit still. They feel best with a tool in there hands then behind a desk. In school we are wasting are greatest source of talent, TRADES PEOPLE THAT ARE BORN TO BUILD!!!!!!

When I was in school why wasn't I taught all of this? I am reading these history books now when I am over Forty!! Why wasn't I given these books to learn from in school? I read about the Wright bros, Edison and now Ford. I have been always taught that the only way to contribute technically was to go to college and get an Engineers degree. I was taught that the Engineers did the thinking and the trades people did the working. Is this true everywhere? Or is this just an East Coast thing. Why don't they teach born to build kids about how Edison and Ford built America, from the dirty and dark machine shops of America's past!!!!!!

I have worked in a few of those machine shops. I loved it.

I'm mad at society. When I was taking trade school at night to complete my aprenticeship they treated me like a second class citezen. They didn't have the proper courses to take. So they made me repeat courses. One of the courses was general math. I took general math three times because they had nothing else for me. It was degrading. I asked to substitute some college math courses instead. They said no!! I had to fully finish four years of trades school before I started taking college courses. I think I took general math back in grade school. I had gotten A's in Algebra and Geometry while in high school. Math came natural and easy to me. When I became a trades person they seemed to label me as stupid!! I actually started to believe them!! I liked the trades and working with tools so much that I was willing to sit through the trade night school. I didn't care if it was supposed to be for the dumb kids, I enjoyed working with my hands.

Think of the possibilities!!

What would have happened if I met Edison back in my twenties who encouraged me on to develop some great things? NO!!!!! I was told that Engineers do the thinking and us trades people just put it together. I was told that doing drawings was taboo. It was frowned on. Drawings were the job of the Engineer. Once when I showed a drawing of some piping arangements I was told by the recipient to stop. I was doing something that I could get fined for!! I wasn't supposed to use my drawings to teach others some of my ideas in my head. I could read drawings. I could write drawings for myself. It is illegal for me to show my drawings to another trades person though. Selling my drawings is against the law!!!!!!!

Edison and Ford traded sketches and drawings all the time!!!!

I have been cheated against and lied too. I have been purposely held back so that society could keep there class society structure intact.

I HAVE BEEN WRONGED!!

John Ruhnke
JR@ComfortableHeat.com

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

jackchips_2

If Mr. Ford

and Mr. Edison said what you just wrote where would we be now?

Please re-read ME's note.

Jack

John Ruhnke

I just want proper respect for trades people..

> and Mr. Edison said what you just wrote where

> would we be now?

>

> Please re-read ME's

> note.

>

> Jack





To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

John Ruhnke

I just want proper respect for trades people..

Jack,

Maybe things are different in other parts of the country. Here in Connecticut switching from college prep class's to trades school was considered a huge downgrade. That is exactly what I did. I was doing well in high school. Everyone from my teachers to my parents was mad at me back then. I made the right choice for me in life. I want other smart kids to make the same right choices too.

JR

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Guy_6

Smaahts

Some of the "smartest" people that I know do not possess the degrees to be titled "Engineers". These are the salt of the earth people whose logic in any given situation always amazes me. Could they design a bridge? Probably-but they would be more likely to tell the designer that it probably should be built higher, or further north in order to accomodate X. There was the old story of the man hired to build the fence around the schoolyard. When finished, the school said that they wouldn't pay him because of the gap that he left at one corner. After the school closed up the gap, they found that the kids quickly ruined the fence in that area because a good portion of them cut through that way on their way home, and a fence was not going to stop them. The first fence man had merely accomodated that with the gap, thus protecting the fence (and their investment). Again, probably not a "containment system engineer", just a man with open eyes and common sense.
The title doesn't make the man, John. I have read your posts, and you are obviously a very intelligent and sensible individual who is able to think outside the box-That's the SMAAHT that keeps it interesting.

OR as stated above-forget the title- as long as your name is written on the check....

Jay_17

John,
Don't get hung up on the title, it really makes no difference. I am an engineer, and I might have been happier as a plumber or HVAC guy, there are alot of perks to your field from my perspective (and I think the money would be similar)
By the way, I can't call my work 'engineered' either, I would need a Professional Engineer License to do that, which few Mechanical Engineers get, because we don't need it.
I am not allowed to design a heating system for my house, but if I worked for Peerless or HTP I could design a boiler for them, does that make sense?
Most engineers are pencil pushers, in school and beyond. Most of them cant use a wrench or solder a pipe. I grew up with these things, my dad taught me how to work on cars, do plumbing, build stuff. Now as I sit at my desk I often think maybe I would prefer to be at a construction site.
Jay

[Deleted User]

Then doing something about THAT...

Start by going to the middle and high school levels and start promoting the trades. As you well know, we are headed for e serious labor shortage crisis. These kids coming up today could make more money than engineers if they play their cards right, and they can get a colege education, paid for by their employer.

Do SOMETHING, lead follow or get out of the way, but kevitching about a title will do NO ONE any good.

ME

John Ruhnke

I am doing as much as possible........

Mark,

I am doing things. I have plenty on my plate and plan to always be adding more. I have a right to gripe. I have worked hard to earn that right. I worked hard to become one of the best radiant heating system designers in the country, that is from both Contractors and Engineers. I am working hard everyday to prove to myself and everyone else that I am worthy of a title such as Engineer. I will prove that trades people are engineers and worthy to be called so. I will prove this and change popular opinion. I have already changed many peoples opinion in my own area that I work out of. I am going global now. I will prove the value of a simple trades person. I have projects in the works that I am very excited about now. I can't yet talk. Things aren't finalized. But I am working on some things.

JR

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Brad White_9

May I?

I do not take any of the above as engineer bashing. Just saying that those with hands-on experience are better in some (Many!) ways is a statement unto itself. Being on the design-side, I take that as a compliment and to extend that word, the two compliment each other. Engineers cannot design what cannot be built. From my experience, what I learned from those with tools in their hands far exceeds what I learned from those with slide-rules. (Those are like calculators if you were born after, oh, about 1965...

Both have made contributions (as jp noted above, look at all the neat s***!)

So, giving credit and praise where due does not come at the expense of any other party. It stands on it's own.

My $0.02

Brad

John Ruhnke

I AM NOT BASHING ENGINEERS!!!!!!!!!!!

JP,

I don't bash engineers. Read my posts more carefully. I am complaining about being discriminated against. I can accomplish the same valuable tasks as engineers. I think that I have proved this over and over again and again. People who hold a college degree want me to know my place in life. They have tried to restrict my advancement in life. All of this is so to add value to there college education. That is why they put all of these restrictions on me. The problem is that they actually don't know my place in life. They have grossly underestimated my abilities and the value of my own education. An education that was just as difficult to earn just as valuable. Because of these restrictions we have boiler standards such as AFUE. AFUE is a joke!!

Things are going to change now. I know what and who I am. No one is going to hold me back any longer. In doing so I think you will find that the world and this country will be changing and for the better. I know my place in life and JP it is much more than what you think it is.

JR

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Paul Pollets

Getting Titled

John, have you considered attending night school to get a BS or BE? Dan H. went at night. My Dad went back to school when he was 60 to get a graduate degree.... It sounds like this is very important to you so I'd say DO IT!!

There are programs that will allow you to design an approved curriculum with a mentor (probably an ME or PE) and you could submit your experience to get serious credit towards the degree. In NY, Empire State College (a part of SUNY) offers both undergrad and graduate degrees, custom tailored to the participant.

When I attended, my mentor was David Aaron, the founder of Creative Playthings. He was a psychologist, architect and master builder. Much of what I do and know came from working with him for several years. I had to take courses in mechanical and architectural drawing, as well as some base courses to qualify. If you have the discipline to complete the requirements, what you want may be very attainable. Your working experiences could easily get you 30-40 credits, when documented.

Don't hold yourself back if you want it. My 2Cents.

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

jackchips_2

Well said

about the hands on, Brad.

After being self-employed and then moving into the design field, I learned no one knew plumbing. From designing (hint-engineering-wink, wink) one bathroom facilities to doing the ten story MA College of Pharmacy building last year in Worcester I know a little about this business.

The State of MA would never certify me as an engineer but as long as my boss keeps signing the checks I'm a happy camper.

I still think Mark made some excellent comments to John and I wish he'd listen to him.

Jack

Ps. I consider you, just from your writings, a true engineer.

John Ruhnke

I never wanted a degree.......

Paul,

I have taken class's at colleges before and I will take more in the future if I find the time. I value education highly. I don't like degrees though. A degree would force me to spend many years studying things of no interest to me. I have taken college class's at University of Fairfield, University of Connecticut, Norwalk Comunity College and Norwalk Technical Institute.

If I find interest in something then I study it. Sometimes it means taking college courses, reading books, technical magazines, calling technical people up and asking many questions, seminars, trade shows. I will also build and try things. I learn to gain knowledge in the area that holds my interest. Degree's mean nothing to me. I just don't want to be discriminated against that is all.

The state of CT forced me to take general math three times. I received A's in high school college prep math courses. I hated that because I could have been doing something much better with my time, like taking college math courses.

JR

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

jp_2

how about belittling then?

I come from a different field, things I worked with, robots, 50,000psi water cutting systems, radio heating machines etc weren't 'designed' by seat-of-the-pants(doesn't mean trail and error wasn't there). most people I met had good backgrounds(educations), and were well rounded.

if you insist on being called an engineer without background in chemistry,phyiscs,mathmantics, etc. you in a sense are saying, those things are NOT important to engineering cause "I" do not need to know them. I'd call that belittling all that engineering is.

jp_2

why?

The state of CT forced me to take general math three times.

why? generally you 'take' stuff over because you didn't get a passing grade??? are you saying you were getting "A's" and they still made you take the course over and over?

John Ruhnke

Two different schools...........

JP,

In high school I got straight A's in Algebra, Geometry and then Trigonometry. I never even really ever had to study. It was easy for me.

In trade school which came after high school they forced me to take class's two nights a week for four years straight. This was to qualify to sit for my mechanics exam. After two years I took every class they offered. I then requested to be excused and take college class's for credit again. I asked to substitute trade class's for college right from the begining too before I took my first ever class. They said no. I asked every year. They always said no. This made me very mad. I have been mad for decades now. The general math class they had was a complete joke. It was equivelent to fourth grade math. The teacher was nice and allowed me to bring in pizza and talk to others in the back of the class. I basicly didn't even participate. The teacher passed me of course. He knew how smart I was. He didn't degrade me by forcing me to sit there and take quizes or stuff. Because he was so easy going I took his class three times.

JR

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

jp_2

trade schools

never been to trade school so can't say anything about that.

I do know that colleges generally don't take credits from technician schools. I sgot in with only basic algebra, generally you can test out into high courses anyway, at least in mich. theres a ton of knowledge to learn after pre-college math.

Brad White_9

You may feel that way, JP

and are free to do so. Not me.

For me, I just see it as a discussion, different views to solving problems, nothing more.

Jay_17

Part of getting a degree is taking courses you don't really enjoy, whether it is "English", or "Partial Differential Equations with Applications". I knew english before college, but I had to take Shakespeare, (I liked it). I also had to take Diff Eq, hated it, but I had to pass it for a degree.
You may just have to accept that that is life, and if you want an engineering degree then you'll have to suck it up. Or just pursue what you like without it. Many people have done either one and had great success.

Just to stirr the pot, I would argue that Ford was not a particularly great engineer. I don't know of anything he designed that was very notable. The Model T was his dream, but the designing was done by others. He was however an incredible buisnessman. With his vision, and the help of others he built a new buisness model, which is probably second only to Walmart in delivering to the customer a product that they didn't realize they needed, and driving the cost down to a incredible level through attention to the minutest detail.
Jay

John Ruhnke

Different backgrounds are needed..........

JP,

Of course they are important. Why would they not be? I judge an engineer by the quality of the product he can produce. If I have an important physics problem I ask a physisist. Chemestry? I go to and learn from a Chemist. Math? I find a mathamatician. I ask the right questions until I know enough to find the right answers. I can't be a chemist, mathamatician and Physisist all at once even if I went to the best schools. I don't try to be one. Then I go build my prototype or heating system or what ever. After years of learning this and trying that I end up knowing a lot. I forget a lot too. That is why I always need experts to rely on. When the Chemist has a problem with hydronics guess what? They often come and talk to me.

JR

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

John Ruhnke

disagree

Jay,

That is why I don't want a degree. I have no interest in furthering my english education.

Go back and read your history books. Ford was a great Engineer. The assembly line was a big project. Of course he had help. Many engineers worked together. Ford was the lead engineer though. No one designed a lone. They all did pieces of this and pieces of that. Ford built his first two cars mostly himself though. Fords first car impressed Edison a lot. The people at Edison Electric recognized Ford as one of the smartest and best engineers in the company when Ford worked there.

JR

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

John Ruhnke

Where would we be now?

Jack,

Edison and Ford had nothing to speak up against. They advanced through life just fine back then. Our country was great back then. What about now?

By restricting the progress of smart trades people we have wasted away our best resources. Ford and Edison most likely would have had a hard time getting ahead in todays world. I am fighting for the modern day Fords and Edisons.

JR

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Mike T., Swampeast MO

For the second time today I thank you for your INSIGHTFUL comments Brad. Curious that one is a matter of RESOLVED fact and the other a matter of HELPFUL opinion...

ScottMP

Respectfully

John, you rail against the discrimination you recieve for not being an enginer and yet say you have no desire to be one ? Which is it ? You may be your own worse enemy.

I belive Paul Pollets gave you the best advice and you found Many Reasons why it owuld not work for you. Go To A College and get a degree, its not as hard as you make it to be. You would then the title and could move along with out the decrimination.

No one to hold you back .. BUT YOU !

Work the system, not against it.

Scott

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Supply House Rick

John

I respect your opinion. If you want PE attached to your title-Go To College, get a Engineering Degree and pass the PE exam. I have a B.A in Behavioral Sciences and too many certifications to count, this doesn't give me the title of Rick MD or Rick PE or anything else? NO-just Rick.

It could be considered insulting to those who earned it. Why is 2-letters holding you back? You want respect for the trades? Go do the best job you can do every single day and it will come. Remember "if you always do what you always did, you will always get what you always got...

We are all in this together

Peace,
Rick

Phil_6

Henry Ford

Henry Ford was not an engineer, but he was a major league screwball and racist. Make sure that your lack of title of "engineeer" doesn't make you as nuts as he was.

Google "henry ford and the jews" You'll get about a million hits like this:


The anti-Semitic activities of automobile manufacturer Henry Ford. Ford first voiced his anti-Semitic leanings in 1915, around the time of his 'Peace Ship' episode. Eventually, his belief that the 'International Jew' was the source of the world's problems led him to conduct a campaign against them in the pages of his newspaper; The Dearborn Independent. The articles in Ford's newspaper blamed the Jews for everything from the Bolshevik Revolution and the First World War to bootlegged liquor and cheap movies. They also accused the Jews of conspiring to enslave Christianity and destroy the 'Anglo-Saxon' way of life. The articles were later gathered into book form and published under the title: The International Jew: The World�s Foremost Problem. This book was translated into 16 languages, and was to have a profound influence upon the growing Nazi movement in Germany. Eventually, Ford publicly apologized for the articles in light of a legal suit. However; he continued to express his anti-Semitic beliefs in his private circles. In the 1930�s, he hired many fascist sympathizers, accepted an award from Hitler; and engaged in business ventures in Nazi Germany. In the 1940's, the Ford Motor Company was transformed into a more tolerant organization through the efforts of Ford's son and grandson. However; Ford himself never abandoned his deep-rooted anti-Semitism. His anti-Semitic literature can still be found in great abundance, more than fifty years after his death. While Ford is considered to be a great man by many Americans, he spawned an ugly legacy of hatred and bigotry that still has ramifications today.

Jay_17

Ford didn't invent the automobile or the assembly line, he did apply the latter to the former, and developed it beyond what others had done. His job at Edison was operating the power generation equipment (he was called Chief Engineer, but as I understand the job was more like a locomotive Engineer). Edison praised his concept and vision of a gas powered buggy (which wasn't a new idea, they had been around for 13 years at least) but I am not sure he ever actually examined the machine (which was sold shortly thereafter. Fords greatest contribution was his vision of a automobile tough enough for daily use, and cheap enough for everyone. And the vision that it would actually be useful (sort of like the personal computer). If you asked a farmer in 1905 if he needed an automobile, he would have laughed at you! what would he do with an unreliable thing that couldn't help him with his work? In 1915 a Model T was seen as a useful tool, and for $280, it could carry product to market, workers to fields, wife to town, whatever.

In those times the difference between a engineer and a tinkerer was not clear, degrees were not important and there wasn't any licensing. You could start calling yourself an engineer and then you were!. You were also a plumber if you could screw a pipe together and an electrician if you could twist wires. You could build your house yourself with no permits or code to follow. If a bridge fell down then heads were scratched and it was built stronger. A building was built taller, and it collapsed, huh, I guess that was too tall! Slowly we learned that structures could be analysed and failure predicted, now if a bridge falls, the Engineer gets roasted, how could this happen!!! a FAILURE!!! impossible!!!
Jay

Brad White_9

We all like degrees....

Fahrenheit, Celsius, just as many as you need.

John Ruhnke

What makes a great engineer?

Scott,

What am I doing in my spare time now? I am reading a history book on Henry Ford. I have a lot of interest in Henry Ford. I have no interest in a degree. I have a lot of interest in an education to make myself better. I educate myself all of the time. Henry Ford was a great Engineer. He first built many prototypes of the car. He then found investors. He went into manufacturering. He developed the assembly line. After a while Ford motor company's assembly line was so efficient that they sold the cars for much cheaper then the competition and still paid the employees twice as much as the competition. All the while they made handsome profits.

How did Henry Ford become such a great Engineer? What makes Henry Ford such a great Engineer? That is the reason I started reading the book. The secret to his success has nothing to do with his formal education. The man once stated that he thought the American revolution started in 1812. He didn't know who Benidict Arnold was. Henry's formal education was lacking.

The man was born to build. He always had a repair or machine shop in his life. He was great with tools. He built or repaired a lot of things. He had a huge interest in engines. He learned everything there is to know about engines. Back then engines were like computers ten years ago. Information on them was not found in traditional school books.

Yes Henry did go to college and take some courses at a Detroit business school. The bulk of his education came when he worked as a machinist at the Detroit Drydock company. There he learned all about engines.

I am reading books about people that I admire, The Wrright Bros, Edison and Ford. I want to be like them. Formal education didn't work for them. Technology moves very fast. You need to seek out the latest, best and newest techniques. Education is important. It is most important who you learn from though. The Wright Bros, Edison and Ford learned every day. They were always attending trade shows, conferences, reading books and such. Then they would build and experiment. They tried many different things. When they tried something and it didn't work they would go out and seek knowledge. They would learn new ways to do things. Then they would try again. This goes on and on till they made things work.

I want to be like them. That is the education that I am after. I learn everyday. I am happy with the way things are. I just want to put out the message to all of those born to build types that are not cut out for college. College is not the only way to learn. Alternative education methods work and are valuable to this country. I want more born to build types to take pride in themselves and strive to succeed.

Many born to build types actually function poorly in school. They display a figity restlessness. They get labelled with ADD. An ADD person can't get himself to actually sit still long enough to do the school work. Then they get labelled as lazy. The fact of the matter is that they never should have been there in the first place. Give that same person a tool and send him off to work. He goes and builds something great!!

I am trying to give some respect to the born to build types. They work hard to acheive success too. Born to build types are just as valuable as college educated types. We deserve the same respect. Born to build engineers should not be called designers. They should be called engineers because that is what they are!!

Edison was an Engineer!!

The Wright Bros were Engineers!!

Ford was an Engineer!!

Bill Gates is a Engineer!!

John Ruhnke
JR@ComfortableHeat.com

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

hr

Your destiny is in YOUR hands now

you are a very driven person decide what you want and go for it.

You have received some of the highest accolades this industry has to offer regarding you work and projects, over the years.

And they were judged and awarded by some of the best engineers in our industry.

Only a few contractors have received such reconition.

What's the beef?

hot rod

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

John Ruhnke

Thanks,

Hot Rod,

Thanks,

JR

To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Tim_33

What IS an Engineer?

JR, you say that you are being discriminated against, which is true, but no unfairly so. You have clearly indicated that you are a tradesman, probably not the "best radiant designer in the country", because there is no such position available. Now, regardless of your opinions or that of the author of the book that you are reading, Henry Ford was not an Engineer, nor did he ever claim to be. You choose to not take ALL of the courses that are required for a Bachelor of Science degree, you choose not to be an Engineer. The degree is simply a minimum reqirement. A filter, through which you have yet to pass. This is reality, not unfair discrimination. Being an engineer is neither better nor worse than being a tradesman, simply different. You are not an enginner and until you earn that designation, refering to youself as such IS misrepresentation. Earning that designation or title entails all the stuff you like AND the stuff that you don't like. Again, your choice. Because you can do your own business accounting does not make you an accountant either, does it? No. Being a very competent specialist/tradesman is a great accomplishment, and for that you should enjoy the pride that you deserve. But, being a very good plumber or mechanic or pipefitter or all of the above is still NOT being an engineer.

John Ruhnke

Definition of an Engineer..

Tim,

Are you reading the same dictionary that I read? Have you ever looked up the definition of an Engineer? Show me where it says the part about college credits?

Definition of an Engineer

1 : a member of a military group devoted to engineering work
2 obsolete : a crafty schemer : PLOTTER
3 a : a designer or builder of engines b : a person who is trained in or follows as a profession a branch of engineering c : a person who carries through an enterprise by skillful or artful contrivance
4 : a person who runs or supervises an engine or an apparatus

Under definition three a: Henry Ford designed and built many great engines.

3b: Henry Ford was trained by the Detroit Dry Dock company in the art of building engines. He did this as a machinist.
Engineering is defined as the art of building engines. Ford actually built them with his own two hands.

3c: Well that one is easy anyone could meet that.

O.K. under definition one Henry Ford was not a militarty guy. I'll give you that one. I would say he meets every other possible definition though.

Henry Ford was an Engineer!!!




Under Definition 4 Henry Ford supervised the running of great engines.


Look at the definition above and show me where I am wrong.

I too built an engine. I used to race cars. I have a patent on a pump. The pump meets the dictionary definition of an Engine.

JR




To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"

Jay_17

Becoming a licensed Engineer - your state may vary

Becoming a Licensed Professional Engineer requires at least 12 years of acceptable education/experience credit. Some of this is often obtained through four years of college study, although there are other ways of obtaining the required credit. After obtaining six years of acceptable education/experience credit, the candidate takes the Fundamentals of Engineering exam. After passing the Fundamentals of Engineering exam, and obtaining at least 12 years of acceptable engineering/education experience, the engineer must pass the Principles and Practice of Engineering exam. Only when all requirements have been met can an individual be considered a Licensed Professional Engineer.

Jay_17

Or you could get a job at AmTrak driving a train.
I went to college for 5 years and I never got to drive the train.
In England a mechanic is called an engineer, and a pharmacist is a chemist....

Jay

Weezbo

my definition of engineer comes from earlier childhood readings

of that once great periodical , Mad Magazine. Whenever you see the word Political or engineered just plug in the word "Fricked" or its approximate equivalent verb tense.

check it out. One day John went to school and was engineered out of his lunch money. So not being totally political he decided to go to class to learn how to engineer. He soon discovered that the entire engineering world was Filled with people engineering every thing and everybody around him.he secretly embarked upon a plan to engineer them right back . *~/:)

Now, I realize that may not be Politically correct,however is does hold a certain ring of political truth to the engineered.

forgive me. i tend to think everyone is a natural engineer,whether they know it or not. To excel at anything one must apply what they know.

So who are "They" and more importantly who are "They" to You?

Reading is fun da mental.:)

Ask any engineer did they go to school to become an engineer,or were they already an engineer looking to refine thier education....
look inward with kind eyes.

John Ruhnke

Licensed civil engineer...........

Jay,

A plumbing and heating mechanic here in America should be called a plumbing and heating engineer just like in England.

JR



To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"