Unknown radiant tubing

George Peteya_4

... both the same. SolaRoll was a six-tube web-connected extrusion, while Radiant Roll started as four tubes, then was made as two. Parts are no longer available, as the parent company Besicorp closed Bio-Energy's doors at the end of 1998.
Nearly Forgotten Facts Dept.: It's EPDM, no barrier, unreinforced, .203" ID, .338" OD. Diameter of punched header hole was .305"-.310". Teflon insert was .250" OD, .750" long. Splices were made with 3/16" brass barb fittings. There was an aluminum insert tool called a "SolaSert" that was used to make the header connections.

Glen

Can you Identify this tubing?

System about 20 years old -

ALH_4

tube

It looks like BioEnergy SolaRoll. It is very small diameter EPDM tube. I don't know that there are any parts available anymore. Has something gone wrong with the system?

Ken_40

I agree w/ Andrew

It looks like plain Jane EPDM (a/k/a black rubbery plastic tubing/hose.)

Which, was and is, remarkably durable!

Glen

sort of

System is intact and working well. Yes its "looks" like EPDM - very soft and pliable. Most of it is BB with only a bit of radiant. But the pH has dropped significantly in the last 12 months, from 9.0 to 7.0. So I am looking for anything that is oxygen permissive.

hr

It gulps O2 like Wanda the fish

and often times corrodes itself into a no flow condition.

The higher the temperature the greater the O2 ingress.

I have seen cases where it would break down and crack at the manifolds. Trying to remove or repair it ends up in split ends.

If you do decide to fiddle with it, buy 1/4" couplings at any automotive store, and the nylon ratchet clamps.

I'd remove and flow test every loop (time consuming) and assure they flow before you try any salvage work.

Then use all non ferrous components or a HX seperation.

Keep a plan B in mind

hot rod

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Glen

HR - you're the best

but methinks I have inherited a monster child (Wanda the fish is appropriate!). I like your idea re flow testing - HO has not reported a cold floor - yet. This is buried under the nicest Mexican tile - plan b may be staple up with plates. I like fixin' - not fiddlin'. I was really surprised with the pH - until the HO showed me his "hidden" manifold in the stairwell. Thanks as well to the post above yours - also very helpful and informative. I double dosed today with moly so will monitor 'til next year - as it was a non ferrous leak that started this process.

Taz Bramlette

Solar Roll

I have about 3000 square feet of concrete slab with leaking solar roll. I would appreciate any suggestions regarding repair, retrofit, legal recourse, etc.

Taz Bramlette

Solar Roll

I have about 3000 square feet of concrete slab with leaking solar roll. I would appreciate any suggestions regarding repair, retrofit, legal recourse, etc.

hr

One good thing

the loops were fairly short, usually 100 feet or less. So you should be able to determine and abandon one loop without much output loss.

Only method I know is to disconnect every loop and pressure test it. Then abandon the bad one(s)

Did the slab crack and shift anywhere? It (Solar roll)didn't take shear stress very well. Most tubes don't.

An infrared camera will often show the leak should you decide to chop and repair.

If more than 20% of the loops leak, or are sludged to a no flow condition... Time for a new heating system. In my opinion.

hot rod

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Weezbo

then you probably have many headers....

need to go look for all of them...

Taz, it is like Hot Rod says...this stuff did not just fall out the back of a truck...it gets crumbly in that instance...crumbly isnt good. the heat exchanger idea is the way to roll might look to dialing the temps down too while you are at it.

Taz Bramlette

Solar Roll

A little history: the house is 16 yr old; 3 zones of approx
1800, 700, & 700 sq.ft. Floor is brick on 1/2" sand on slab. Weil-McNiel boiler 5 yr. old (original caught on fire) supplies zones thru one 1" & two 3/4" copper pipes. Zones cannot be isolated at boiler room. House is U-shaped SIP construction. I believe there are two manifold areas behind sheetrock. Leak found below slab in 1" kinked copper pipe 3 yr ago. American Leak Detectors found leak this time in radiant roll with He detection; repaired, still leaks about 1/2 gal in 1 1/2 hr. System currently OFF. I've considered new tubing and manifolds placed on slab, covered with 1" of sand, then bricks. Costs estimates about $5/sq.ft. Is this feasible, are costs reasonable, are there other options? Thanks for suggestons.

Paul Mitchell_3

Wow been a while

Last time I saw stuff like that was in 1987. We were installing a boiler....Teledyne...in a warehouse. A radiant company had that stuff in the floor. I got the low man job of going around with those little couplings Hot Rod showed fixing leaks. That was the only time I have seen that stuff till now.

hr

If you have leak problems

in the copper feeders AND the solar roll... It probably is time to start over.

I'm not a fan of sand under the bricks, sounds messy for an indoor use? Also the heat transfer thru sand and brick must be fairly slow?

If you have sand and brick you should have enough thickness to put new tube down on the current slab and float a new slab over it. Then new floor coverings, pavers, brick, whatever,

As`always I suggest a heat load calc to get a good workable new system designed. Remember floor coverings are an important part of the load calcs, if you plan on changing any.

I'm not sure I would put a lot more money into a 16 year old non barrier tube system

hot rod

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Darrell

Sounds like you're up against the life of the tubing and manifolds...although I see those systems that are still working well today as long as the fluid is separated from ferrous metals. But...short term, get a 10' square piece of clear visqueen and spread it on the floor...your leak will show up in about 5 minutes as condensation on the under side of the visqueen. Your system will have to be running when you do this. Move the visqueen from area to area until you find it. Then dig it up a splice it.

This will even work on concrete floors as long as they aren't covered with vinyl. Works great with carpet and findings leaking copper runs too.

Or, pressure up and get some cheap clamps at the local hardware store. Valve off one side of the manifold and clamp off indiviual tubes on the other side in turn until
you stop losing pressure. You can most likley run for some time with some of the tubes pinched off. Take care not to disturb the manifold though...

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