Coal to oil steam

Jim Franklin

A friend moved into his new place yesterday and after we'd lugged his posessions up to the 2nd floor and were relaxing with beer in our sweat-soaked clothes it started to get cold. So we turned on the heat (he's near Boston). It's an old coal system converted to oil. It took at least 45 minutes for the near boiler piping to get hot. There is no header. One 2" riser feeds all but one of the rads, one 1.5" rider feeds a lone rad.

Once the system is cooking it puts out decent heat. I checked out the main vents. The 2" loop (about 100') has one vent that doesn't look too big. The other riser has no main vent and also appears to have no return.

Could the lack of main venting be preventing the piping even 1 foot from the boiler from getting hot, or is it just a huge thermal mass, or is it the inefficiency of the system, or? We're trying to decide if it's worth the $100 or so to add vents (the rads need new ones too) now or wait until the summer when he'll switch to gas and a new boiler and FHW with panel rads.

thanks,
jim

Mad Dog_2

Not unless all the radiator vents are clogged too

Air will find a way to get out and steam up. It is probably a way-underfired and filthy boiler. May not really be safe to run. I would rec'd staying with oil, Use A Burnham Megasteam, and Hire someone from FAP (Find A Professional) at this site to scope it out and do the job. Your friend is ready for a new boiler. Mad Dog

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Steamhead (in transit)

The fact that he's using oil now

and distributing heat by steam, is NOT an inherent defect. Ripping everything out will not be a cost-effective move at all. Switching to gas will put him in the clutches of an unregulated monopoly that can raise prices at will, unless he gets a boiler that can burn either fuel.

I bet either the boiler is dirty inside, or is not properly baffled, or the burner is underfired, or maybe all three. The burner on that boiler should not make any smoke or soot at all- if it does, it's not set up properly. The main vent size plays a part here, but first of all you have to make the steam leave the boiler!

Steam boilers have come a long way since that Ideal sectional boiler was made. My first choice would be the Burnham MegaSteam, here's the link:

http://www.burnham.com/mega.htm

Currently this boiler is only offered with an oil burner, but Burnham is aware that we want a gas version too. For a fuel-convertible steam boiler that's available now, the Smith 8 series is a good choice- when equipped with a gas burner it's called the G8. Go here (note that Smith's site is running a bit slow today):

http://www.smithboiler.com/html/series8.asp

http://www.smithboiler.com/html/g8.asp

The advantage of this is that the owner could switch fuels without buying a new boiler, by just having a pro replace the burner and a couple of related items and tune everything up. So the owner could choose based on cost per BTU, and the whole setup would be supported by the boiler manufacturer.

Also, the wet-base design of the MegaSteam and 8 series has the advantage that the flame is almost completely surrounded by water-backed cast iron. In the usual atmospheric gas boiler the base is wide open, and much heat is lost from this area (and the DOE tests do not take this into account). Ever wonder why you can't install atmospheric boilers on combustible floors? Now you know.

Steam as a method of distributing heat has its advantages. One which most people don't think of, is that the system drains completely dry when it shuts off except for some piping in the basement and the boiler itself. So the risk of a freeze-up on a steam system in an extended power failure is almost zero, unlike a hot-water system.

If that long steam main really is 100 feet of 2-inch pipe, vent it with three Gorton #2 vents. This will make the steam get to the end of the main in a super hurry.

There are plenty of good steam men in the Boston area- have your friend try the Find a Professional page of this site.

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John@Reliable_14

I'm on the south shore....................

and it looks like most of the boilers I see! As Matt said I bet its way under fired too. I see boilers like this fired at 1 gallon or less all to often. Best to have someone who "really" understands steam check it out, as far as gas depending where you are(town)oil may give you the best bang for your buck, plus if you don't like your oil company there are plenty of others ready to take thier place, unlike gas which is the only game in town.John@Reliable

Jim Franklin

yabbut

Thanks for all the info, but here's the kind of panel rads he's after:

http://www.stelrad.com/UK/excel_tech_info.html

(that was in response to me sending him Dan's radiatori Italiano link, a tongue in cheek move that backfired as I had no idea he was going that far away from the old columnar standby, aesthetically speaking)

So the steam is definitely short lived, as much as I'd like to see him keep it.

jim

Steamhead (in transit)

Yabbut

has he seen these?

http://www.steamradiators.com/

If I was doing a house with steam, these would be my choice.

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