Simple program for piping diagrams

Unknown

Larry,

I have used the Visio (attached sample), Taco, Siggy's, Autocad. I find the Visio easier to use, quicker to get immediate results and I can make my own stencils.

Taco and Tekmar have stencils available.

I have made over 200 stencils myself and can make a piping diagram very quickly. Wire diagrams take a little time... but still faster then pencil and paper :-)

Larry Savino

I am looking for a some what simple affordable program to use for diagramming a boiler installation.

My hand drawn renderings are getting a little confusing for our installers, I am hoping I can find one with the symbols already in the programs,Example

Circulator
expansion tank
pop valve
water supply
back flow
flow arrows
zone valves
ball valves
Well you get the idea

Does anybody know of a boiler manufacturer that may have one available

Thanks Larry

Ted_9

program

What about Hydronic
Cad.

http://www.hydronicpros.com/

I think there is a free demo.

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EBEBRATT-Ed

I have use Visio a little. I found it difficult to us but I was probably the problem.

Ed

Larry Savino

Well I down loaded the programs free trial. Its seams simple enough but does not allow to insert a line/or connection into a line any place with in the line.Example would be if you drew your supply and return and then decided to connect your water supply line it defaults to the end or the begining of the excisting line you have just drawn.

And I guess I think 285.00 is not what i was exspecting as affourdable but I am probably way off base as to what I should spend. Allot better then a full blown cad program for thousands of dollars.

Thank you every one

Jed_2

That irritates me too, but

just draw segments to intersect where you want the tee, or just put in the "twin tee" if P/S. Not much flexible adaptability, but works very nice once you get used to it.

I understand Siggy will be making available some template drawings soon for download. Looking forward to them.

Jed

hr

draw the line

drop it, then drag it into place. If you do any sort of hydronic design, install, or troubleshooting invest in the combo HDS and HydroniCAD package. Some of the best money you will ever spend

hot rod

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Larry Savino

Yup I can figure away around it by deleting the original line then placing the tee where I want it and then replacing the 1-original line with two new lines,but it always seams we are working around things that are supposed to make our life easy.

I do not know enough about the programs to complain about it or to sway some one else buying decision so please don't let me sway your decision's seams simple enough to use

Larry Savino

Well we are an installing contractor so we do tons of Designs that are normally made up on a sheet of yellow paper with my lines and pumps and valve all over that our installer are using. I was just looking for a lazy,more professional way of making them a diagram. We do always leave a drawing behind for the future repair technicians and a copy of the diagram in the customers folder. Just trying to bring my self into this century with all of the modern technologies available to us nowadays

hr

the HydroniCAD program

was built with the contractor in mind. Quick and easy to learn without a big cash outlay. It will continue to grow and refine.

As Jed mentioned, soon you will have pre built drawings to download. Saves having to have to start from scratch everytime.

Also wiring symbols will be available so you can do mechanical and wiring plans and as builts.

Once you get the hang of it you will use it more than the yellow pad

I'm on the low end of the computer literacy scale but have learned the HydroniCAD program quickly.

hot rod

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RonSBC

Prefer Visio...

I like the visio progrma better. alot of options good support, If you dont like the premade stencils, then you can buildthem for future use. If you can operate any windows based program, excel, word, and outlook, then your future with visio is bright. Just my two cents. I have been using Visio 2002 pro, since it was brought on the market, everything from piping design, motor controls, and ladder diagrams, it does it all and has required very little add stencils from my own creation.

Josh_10

Ya HydroniCad is a good program. You can teach yourself in about an hour. Inexpensive too in comparison to AutoCad. Our 2002 version of AutoCad was around $2500.

JohnNY

You probably already have one if you're using Windows.
Lots of people like Mark eatherton and myself use Microsoft Paint.

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JohnNY

How's this one?

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Larry Savino

All right I will try microsoft paint tonight to see if i can diagram the cracked boiler I am describing in my other post today

Forget the paint program I just tried it and its not forgiving to mistakes with out having to start over

Larry Savino

John thats spectacular,You did that in the paint program?

I may have to enlist the help of my son here as some how he is able to draw animated cartoon on my home computer and lap top

JohnNY

Thanks!

> John thats spectacular,You did that in the paint

> program?

>

> I may have to enlist the help of my

> son here as some how he is able to draw animated

> cartoon on my home computer and lap top





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JohnNY

Thanks!

Yes, those are made in MS Paint.

This one came out real nice, too. I used it to order some pipe to sketch.

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JohnNY

Sure it is!

Click "edit" then "undo".

Or just use the eraser. The eraser works just like the paintbrush or pencil, but in reverse.

It really is worth another shot.

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Weezbo

Larry. The dollar for Hydronic lay outs and designe from

the hallowed halls of the Sig is a very good deal.

i have got to be the slowes typer guy here,see i used to have a job breaking bricks for a living and totally flunked typing in school due to my inability to make my nose hit the keyboard as fast as everyone else using their fingers *~/:) my thumbs worked kinda good though :)ok ..so i am real good at the space bar and anything that does not require a lot of letters:)

the mouse.

too bad the mouse didnt invent typing

Dan Joyce_4

JohnNY
How did you get the pump, boiler drains etc.in the drawing.
Thanks
Dan Joyce
Kinderhook NY

[Deleted User]

Each item...

is built and saved as its own entity as a JPEG drawing. Attached you will find some instructions I wrote a long time ago showing people how to use MS Paint to do drawings. It requires practice, and regular use to get it all down pat.

I will also attach a large JPEG of different drawing sysmbols that you can also use with paint. Use the EDIT lasso to isolate individual items and SAVE tehm as individual components.

At present, I use MS Visio for all of my drawings. Some people don't like it, and at first I didn't either. Now that I use it all the time, I like it much better.

Paint is a great place to start, but you will eventually need to move forward and utilize better drawing tools. Siggys program works great for a small residential contractor, but isn't adequate for larger commercial/custom jobs. It's great for what its intended for. His hydronic analysis software has no equals in the industry.

ME

Brad White_38

Drawing Programs, Larry

I use a number of these. Siggy's HydroniCAD is kind of nifty but, as you said the line snapping to ends and not intersecting is a tad annoying. I am keeping a list of features that I would like to see or see eliminated and submitting them to John S. for future releases. Siggy is nothing if not responsive to his public.

I also use AutoCAD Actrix (no longer offered I believe). Very much like Visio. I also have Visio Technical (not current, pre Microsoft-Buy-Out).

But for day to day drafting I have AutoCAD LT 2000. Current versions are about $850 I think. Does just about everything I need including plans, schedules, diagrams. No need to shell out $3,750 for the full 3D version! And with AutoCAD you can make blocks of commonly used items such as valves, boilers and equipment, even hook-ups and other repetitive items. Customizable library that is yours to make or use.

Let me know if you go that route. I am willing to share some of my block library.

HVAC Solution and the Taco Partner version (Freeware from the Taco site, part of their Load-Match program last I checked) is an incredible tool for figuring out loads and connectivity. I have the full pro version as an upgrade to my charter purchase over four years ago. It has progressed quite a bit.

Valves and such can be diagrammed reasonably. Definitely worth downloading and playing with it before you get serious. Nothing quite like it, but more a design and presentation tool rather than a means to convey instructions to your installers. Then again, no reason you cannot do that once they all are on the same legend/page, right?

For graphic clarity nothing is as neat as HydroniCAD, just some of the features and tool commands are not smooth (yet) nor as intuitive as I would like (yet). But I bet he is working on it....

My favorite toy, er, tool? Not for diagramming but Radiant Floor Design- LoopCAD by Avenir. I bought mine through Siggy's site. Limited to radiant floor loops, this program is simply fun to use, simple and smart. Not to your question but damn, I have too much fun with it.

My $0.02,

Brad

JimL

The rosetta stone we all seek for this has yet to be discovered as far as I can tell. Like Brad, I like AutocadLT for most drawing work but there is nothing I know of that ties it all together. I like the LoopCad (From Siggy as well) but for some complicated circuits, a polyline in AutoCad can sometimes be easier than cutomizing the loops in LoopCad. Viega mentioned that they are working with LoopCad on software that will try to tie it all together but ultimately that is the niche alot of us fill. Sure you can have the local supply house give you a radiant plan..but it lacks the small detail of where the 13 loops (that are coincidently all exactly 287 feet long) actually get installed on the project.
I saw on This Old House or one of those shows a few weeks back, a gentleman demonstrating a program he designed that I thought configured radiant loops and ductwork with the same program. Anyone out there see or remember this or was the CO in my house running a little high that day?
Jim

Paul Rohrs

In late breaking news.....

I am still a Visio "Hound".

I love being able to import any JPEG and save it as a stencil. This mostly pertains to boilers that I like to use the actual picture of. Not really any big deal I suppose, but it helps dress out the picture.

The real beauty is all of the available stencils that you can get from manufacturers, or just make yourself. I have just completed making up the Caleffi Hydrolink stencils. It really is a benefit to Matt J, (my right and left hand) because I think he is as "Visual" a person as I am. And we can refine the drawing as much as we need to.

I have had Visio for about 5 years now, had HydroniCAD been around, I would have been all over it.

I have learned a great deal from others, especially NRT.Rob and Hydronics Mike to the North. They posses a great deal of knowledge in schematics and diagramming.

The very nice thing about owning any diagramming software, is that you can develope your OWN style to fit your needs.

I think it is an invaluable tool for documenting your system. Each of our jobs get a job binder with warranty, IOM, system schematics, and an 8 x 10 color glossy of myself, (No, not really). If I were to be hit by a bus,
a qualified hydronician would be able to see how the system is layed out and controlled.

Maybe tomorrow when I get back to the office, I'll post some of the jobs with the Hydrolink.

Remember to "Save early and often".

Regards,

PR


Edit:

Jim,

I saw that show, I am pretty sure he was using the "Wrightsoft" program. I know it has been OEM'd out to quite a few vendors. (Zurn Pex is one I know of.)


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steve b_17

I've had good luck with TurboCad -

It's a remarkably powerful, inexpensive, and easy to use CAD program that generates AutoCad-compatible DXF files. Like any CAD software, it takes some practice before you can use it efficiently, but in contrast with AutoCad it has a fairly intuitive interface that is easy to learn.

TurboCad has standard symbol libraries that you can download, and it is very easy to make your own symbols and create a custom library.

TurboCad Deluxe, Version 11 is just $129, and older versions are available online for less than $20. You can download a trial version for free. I've used version 4 for years.

TurboCad allows you to make much more precise drawings than are possible with Visio and Paint. And it is also a powerful diagramming tool.