Hydronic A/C???

GMcD

You CAN run cool water through radiant emitters and get some radiant cooling off them, but it is best done through large surface areas - floors, walls, and best from ceilings. BUT, the humidity levels have to be controlled to avoid condensation at the cool water temps (generally 62F min). The house MUST also have a ventilation system with any kind of hot water/radiant heating/cooling system, and that is where you control humidity - at the HRV with a DX or chilled water cooling coil.

Of course, the total comfort system depends on a great building envelope to reduce the heating and cooling loads in the first place. Any home heating system change-out or upgrade shpould be approached with a combination of building envelope improvements as well as at the heating plant.

And, no, radiant heating/cooling systems do not have to be "expensive, premium" systems. The only reason they are perceived that way is that not too many people know what they are doing, and add risk factors and higher costs, since that is what people have been taught to expect. Teach em different.

Dave DeFord_2

Hydronic Ac/

Dave DeFord_2

Hydronic A/C???

I have an old farm house that is currently heated with steam I have managed to get to work fairly well. Trouble is that my wife absolutely HATES the radiators. I have been thinking about my choices and under-floor radiant seems to be the best solution I have. My questions are:

1. Is it possible to use the under-floor radiant system to cool the house in the summertime? I have a lot of land so I was thinking about using geo-thermal cooling and pumping the water (glycol?) through the hydronic system to cool the house in the summer. Is this possible and would I have condensation issues?

2. If I remember my reading I need minimum R-13 in the walls to run radiant heat under hardwood floors. I saw a post referring to microfoil tonight and it looks to be a solution as I have NO wall cavities into which to put any insulation. The interior walls of the house are essentially a coat of plaster on the interior of the exterior glazed tile walls (think block walls). I was thinking of putting up firring strips on 16" centers and use the microfoil under the sheetrock. Is this R-value correct and does anyone have any experience with microfoil?

Anybody have any thoughts on these ideas?

Doug_33

Dave, why does your wife hate the radiators? If they look bad, why not sandblast and powder coat them? Is she seeking a restoration or a preservation? In my mind, the latter retains pieces of progress that collectively, make up the fabric of the home. Radiators are part of that story. Nicely maintained, they can add, not detract from the aesthetics of the house. If even cleaned up, they really clash with a period style of the house that predates them, there are many metal and some wood covers available that would allow you to retain them with little evidence. I have yet to see a pro post anything that would ok cooling the house with same circuit (radiant or radiator) that would be used to heat it. I can't see switching to radiant just to install a separate forced air system to cool. If you are going to stay with hydronic heating, I would keep the radiators to heat and use window units or mini-split a/c to cool (Plan A). If you can stand a spacestation's worth of ductwork in your attic and/or basement, you could use the boiler to create hydro-air heating and add central air for cooling, both distributed by the same mini/hi-velocity or conventional ducts (Plan . Unfortunately, even miniducts require sizable attic and/or basement installations, so, if you have a view worth saving in either place, I would go with Plan A.

Dave DeFord_3

She doesn't like the...

looks, she doesn't like the loss of wall space, she doesn't like the dust they collect, she doesn't like much of anything about them. The cat on the other hand loves the covers, but kitty doesn't get a vote. Her mind is made up I'm not even going to attempt to change it. The best I can hope for is to talk her out of scorched air thus the questions about the hydronic A/C. I'm thinking I'm going to need to put in a high-velocity A/C system separate from the heating system.

I learned a while ago that a married man can be one of two things right or happy, in this case I choose to be happy.

Doug_33

If you ask my wife, I guess she'd say I'm still learning that lesson.............

If you're going for high velocity cooling, I would go for a combined system and use hydro-air to heat with it, too. I agree that it is not pure hydronics, but even though we love our radiators, if we ever go to high velocity cooling, our beloved radiators will be going, too. I just can't see having such an intrusive system function for only half the year.

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Dave DeFord_2

Kinda figured that...

Just wanted to make sure. I can see where the condensation would be a big problem and cause the rot. I also was not thinking of running steam through the floor it would be too hot - I would have to convert my boiler to hot water (WM tells me it can be done) and go that route. I'm just trying to look at all of the options before I make a move. Got lots of learning to do and won't be doing anything for a year or more.

J.C.A._3

Maybe.....

She Who Must Be Obeyed (SWMBO) would consider panel radiators? Show off the Buderus and/or Runtal radiators and see if they make her smile.

I agree with Doug that the radiators BELONG there, too bad Kitty doesn't have a say but I bet he/she will like either radiant floors or panel rads. too. I also like the split systems over the high velocity units. They are very quiet, and can more or less "zone" the cooling better than a whole house system. (a bit pricy to do it this way...but isn't COMFORT the goal?). JMHO. Chris

Kevin O. Pulver

Dave

IF you could run cold water through your radiators, it would not solve the humidity problem; which is where most of the discomfort of hot weather comes from. I've read from Dan or somewhere that the Germans have some cooling lines placed in the ceiling AND super de-humidifiers working with them. As I remember, this is outrageously expensive and only done in certain commercial applications. I love your comment by the way about being right or happy. I'm pretty happy myself! Kevin

Jamie_6

Dave,

Where are you located?

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