Steam systems and digital programable thermostats

QnA

I live in a condo complex of 6 buildings, some 3 story high and some 6 story high. Recently a home owner suggested to the Board that we replace our old thermostats with digital programmable thermostats as a way to save on gas costs. The property manager recommended against this with a vague explanation that ups and down regulations in temperatures by a thermostat will interfere with a necessary steam pressure building up, and therefore will not work, and could even cause the heating to stop functioning all together. We are in Minnesota, so this was one scary argument. The Manager also advises the home owners NOT to turn their thermostats below 68 degrees, which looks to me a bit high. He also has a pattern of quite predictably advising against any measures that are likely to create more work for him. So, I am wondering - it this is true about the digital thermostats not being compatible with steam heating systems? Our condos were build in 1987 and the equipment is from that period. Some of our residents are retired and on a fixed income, so we really want to do something about our gass bills.

Steamhead (in transit)

Please provide

a bit more info. Do you have one t-stat per building? Zone valves? Does each building have its own boiler? One-pipe or Two-pipe? How well does the system work over-all? How old are the buildings? Are they older than the 1980's or was the steam system installed in the 80's??!!

Usually, a system such as the Tekmar 269 with an outdoor temperature sensor is better for the larger steam systems.



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QnA

I will have to find out about the one-pipe and two-pipe. Each building has its own boiler. One of the boilers was replaced - it exploded last year, we were on the news. Most of the boilers are the original boilers installed when the buildings were built in 1987-89. The buildings are approx 18 years old. Our pipes run through the underground garage and are not insulated. The condos are heated well most of the time, except on very cold days when we have problems with the heat not being enough. In this case our maintenance people come in and turn up the pressure. They instruct home owners not to play with the thermostats and to keep them at 68 or above.

Dan_29

heat problem

You may need to hire a heating consultant as property managers are hired on a low bid basis and therefore will do as little as possible.

The complexities of heating systems (especially large multiple heating systems in a complex such as yours) may be to difficult to trouble shoot, from afar, in this forum. For example, I am surprised that a building built in the 1980s has a steam heating system in it, as few steam systems have been installed in residential buildings since the 1950s. Zoned forced hot water is much more prevalent.

Maintaining a system at 68 degrees or more at all time is wasteful and expensive. I expect that your management company does not care as they can raise condo fees or rents to continue this wasteful practice.

I suggest that you informally organize with some other owners and/or tenants before you bring this up with the management company at condo association or tenant meetings again. Plan to hire a heating consultant for a written opinion as to what may be done to make the system more efficient and less costly to run.

This report should request written recommendations as to what could be done, at what expense and what would the payback be in terms of time and money saved by owners/tenants for making these improvements.

Possible sources of consultants are:

-the "find a pro" section of heatinghelp.com(above)

-your local utility (gas/electricity) has an energy audit, boiler repair and estimating department which could check your system and suggest weatherization procedures to tighten up each condo/apartment

-a private consultant(fee for service) heating engineer could recommmend a retrofit for your heating system

Please make sure that you understand what services will be provided, at what cost and on what sort of timeline from any contractor/consultant you hire. The advice you receive from a competent professional could save you money and increase comfort.

Be aware that organizing your fellow owners/tenants to overcome a naysaying property manager and owners who won't part with any money to hire a consultant will be difficult but could be rewarding.

Dan

PS: Since some of your residents are seniors, your local or state senior citizen service agencies may be able to help by referring residents to heating contractors or energy audit services.