How far do you go?

EBEBRATT-Ed

Design the system for them and get paid for it. We give out miminal info on our quotes unless we are paid for our design. Then they can go out to bid apples for apples.

It's better for you as well as if you don't get the job you at least get paid for the design.

It protects you(well, not really) against a low bidder doing a cheap job---------if they make him follow your design.



ED

Steve Ebels_3

How far do you go on a quote

I am working up a price for a possible job this summer in a bank. We do all their service and maintenance in 11 branches right now and they have asked me to design an updated system for one of them. I know for a fact that their head of maintenance will recommend us for the job but the bean counters at the main office downstate will want some bids.


My quandary is this, I'm probably going to spend in the neighborhood of 30-40 hours doing loads, measuring, site visits, tracking down materials, looking up prices, and drawing up plans. Then they are going to ask for information about my design so that others can bid on the same equipment. How do I protect my up front investment in this job, which the competing bidders will not have, without coming across like a jerk and jeopardizing a very good and carefully cultivated relationship?

Uni R_3

Charge them for that time

If you're doing them a service - preparing them for an RFQ or whichever... you deserve to get paid. Then they can think that's a deposit should they go with you.

Perry_3

I suggest that you submit your bid in two fashions

First:

Go ahead and measure up and design your system.

Put a price on it.

Submit a cover letter with your total bid price with a very very basic description (without the details). Indicate that you will supply the details of your calculated heat loss, what equipment you will install and its advantage, and how the system will work after the other bids are collected so that your plan can be compared for technical merit agains the other bids, as well as cost. Be sure to explain the long term value and expected long term cost of maintenance and fuel savings in the detailed portion.

In the nuclear power plant that I work all bids are split into two parts. A price part - and a technical part. People like me review the technical part and rank submitted bids first into two groups: Will do the job and is techniacally adequate, and won't do the job. Amoung the technically adequate bids - we often will rate the different bids from the best solution to the worst solution. We never see the pricing. Low bid almost never wins. Contracting will select a higher cost bid based on our recomendaitions that it is a better option than another. This has come about from an understanding that when dealing with power plants that the best solutions are often the lowest cost long term solutions. Of course, if the second best solution is a lot lower than the best... then the best does not win (money and value does count).

Hope this helps,

Perry

Bernie Riddle_2

little by little

"We do all their service and maintenance in 11 branches right now"

I think you can recoup the cost of the estimate....

heatboy

A retainer would.................

..........be a good start. Say......$500.00. It let's you know they are serious. That is, unless you like to practice :-)

hb

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[Deleted User]

Ask them to pay for the engineering...

You design the system for HALF the price they'd normally pay, they feel good about getting a good deal, and you get paid for a professional service. If they want an enginner to review and stamp your drawing, they pay for that in addition to your design services. Its their option...

At that point, they are allowed to **** out, er I mean, solicit additional bids based on your design/spec, but you get final approval of the installing contractor, because its your design:-)

That's not asking too much. It's a WISE investment.

ME

JimH

what level of detail for HO?

Hi, I'm preparing to get some bids on my mod-con/indirect
job, and I'm wondering what level of detail you guys think
is appropriate for a homeowner to ask for. Should I draw
up a spec sheet? Nobody I've talked to yet has mentioned
doing a detailed heat loss. Should I expect to pay for a
heat loss calculation?

-JimH

clammy

leaving details out

Steve i feel your pain ,i have stopped even thinking about your subject matter .I used to do all the leg work and now when they want a bid and in writting i leave out all unit model # and btu ratings out ( no btu for heating and cooling ) sorry but i found being vague is the best bet with propasals .Otherwise the building owners or HO just take your propasal with all the info and fax it around looking for the cheapest guy since they have all the sizing and layout from you for free ,i feel if they want such a detailed propasal then they should be perpared to pay for your time and brain right?Or as my one partner says we do work the old fashion way we do it and send you a bill if you want to count every bean then we will but i can tell you now you won't like the price .Personal i always give people a idea of the costs and if there shocked well it's time to go ,it seems these days alot of people just shop price or get sucked in by a great sales guy who knows squat .On commerical jobs i give only the manafactures model without the series # ( no sizing)other wise 2 months down the road some one else is there doing your speced job .At least that,s how i see it peace and ther best of luck clammy

Al Letellier_9

how far

This is how far I would go......there is a huge difference between the head of maintenance and the VP in charge of infrastructure and facilities. A bank with that many branches most certainly has a guy-in-a-tie that makes these kind of decisions. Go find out who he is and make your pitch directly to him. And get paid for what you know and what you do.

Steve Ebels_3

Thanks guys

Lot's of good input and food for thought here, even the one that says make it up on the service for the other branches.

Weezbo

be real careful this year....

i think we can all expect some choppy price changes....

commercial work is spendy on the materials side and i honestly feel that there is a change coming....

i am always playing it close to the vest and i can tell by looking at my belt that i have run out of notches*~/:)

The last time that happened the proverbial bubble burst...my bid's with 30 cents a foot copper went 1.20$ before the job ended...best to be guarded on just what size equipment etc, and just give them a general idea. Say that you will discuss this matter more fully in person and elude to the last work of consequence that you finished for them.