WM Ultra or Buderus GB-142???

S Ebels

Why doesn't Buderus assemble a directory of DEALERS/CONTRACTORS where people can actually buy the product. Making the distributors say, "I can't sell it to you", is seen as rude and protectionist, if you will, by many consumers that I have talked to about this subject.

It wouldn't be all that difficult to start building such a data base using a list generated by who has been through your training out there.

BTW, I'd like to get back there again sometime.


>)hint, hint(<

Eric_21

WM Ultra or Buderus GB-142

I need to replace my existing Crown cast boiler (it has a crack) that feeds cast iron rads (heat loss of 80,000 btu). I have decided to have one of the condensing units installed and I have an installer who is very qualified, but has not installed one of the condensing units yet. He will install and support any unit, he said it was my choice. Question is which one. Through my research on The Wall and vendor websites I have narrowed it down to the Ultra or the GB-142. The only major differences that I see is that the GB-142 does not have outdoor reset yet but it does supply the prefab manifold. I have heard the GB-142 has been on the market for 10+ years in Europe (more of a track record to get the bugs worked out) but I'm not sure about the Ultra 5 years maybe??? I think both are great products and competitively priced. Pros and cons would be greatly appreciated.

Eric

Mike T., Swampeast MO

The Buderus definitely has reset--Indoor reset. Most standing iron systems already operate with a very crude form of indoor reset.

Based on control alone I would lean towards the Buderus IF your present system is quite well balanced, e.g. no objectionally cold or hot rooms. Be aware that the extremely tight control possible via indoor reset has the potential to somewhat magnify imbalances. The location of the indoor sensor/temp adjuster (I can't bare to call it a thermostat since it's proportional) is absolutely critical and the present thermostat location may not be the best. Since it's not wireless, I'd honestly consider tethering the thing on nearly the longest acceptable cable and experimenting with different locations (with days for evaluation of each) before drilling the final holes for permanent placement.

Mike Reavis_2

The Aluminum \"Monoblock\" used in the W/M has

a least 10 successful years in Europe. The block is imported for W/M.

Mike

Floyd_16

Eric.....

the best boiler is the one that you can get the best support for in your area....
I use the WM simply because there isn't a dealer for the other boiler anywher close to me in the middle of nowhere N. Central Pa...... ther are however some great WM distributors and a WM Rep. that will bend over backwards to make sure that I am happy!!!!
Oh you got two series 2 boilers and one series 1 .... no problem.... you have an indirect that was hookup backwards by a carpenter/plumber and it went bad... no problem... you got plugs that leak, no problem... you need help with an 18,000 sq ft building layout, no problem.... and the list could go on and on.....
If you can get that kind of service from the other guys, than go for it..... that's what makes one brand better than the other... the assembly that makes up the "boiler" is great on both account.... the people behind them are what makes the difference!!!!!!

Floyd

[Deleted User]

Eric, check with the AHJ in your area

some of these Aluminum heat exchanger condensers do not have an H stamp yet and will be turned down by the inspectors. Their present approvals are only as water heaters not heating boilers.

Tim_24

The Ultra does..

have an "H" stamp and has a 15 year service history on the HX, 3 years in North America.

Dave Heath_2

GB142 Buderus approvals

You are right. The Buderus GB142 Heaters do not have the 'H' stamp yet. In Alberta they have been approved as Instant heaters only and have installation restrictions placed on them. We can only use them when they are connected to a DHW Indirect and space heating. Space heating only is not allowed. Wierd approvals!

Joe@buderus

GB142

The GB142 will have the "H" stamp within a very short time. The present aluminum block design has been in service for the last 15 years in Europe and earlier models another five years. Indoor reset is available with the outdoor reset module coming out late in 2006. The outdoor reset module will connect into exsisting GB142. The premade manifold included with each GB142 insures proper piping and flow. The Buderus website has a "Where to Buy" feature to locate distributors.

Constantin

Well...

... both of them are "new" to the North American market. The Ultra had a bit of a rocky start with some early adopters having to deal with circuit board lockouts and/or being subject to a CPSC product recall (1,700 units). Now that the teething issues seem to be largely overcome, it should be safe to buy.

Since Singh is reporting that the Buderus GB142/24 is backordered 4-6 weeks, perhaps the Ultra is the better choice at this juncture. Plus, the Ultra already offers outdoor reset and is a "H" ASME approved boiler. Piping the boiler properly is made easier by the beautiful and handy manifold that Buderus supplies, but any skilled installer will be able to provide the same.

Dave_22

Another year for outdoor reset????? Why so long????

Dave_22

anyone?????

S Ebels

Probably .....

Just the morass of approvals that anything sold for heating purposes in this country has to go through. Doesn't matter if it's been used for 90 years safely in another part of the world. The approval agencies here still have to collect their "back door tax".

[Deleted User]

Buderus approvals \"soon\"

Joe, will you be sure to let us all know just as soon as the approvals are actually in place, as well, which jurisdictions the approvals are going to be in effect in? You have been saying "soon" for quite a long time.

jr_6

I agree that some may take offense to a distributor stating that they can not sell to a homeowner. But, the homeowner needs to be aware that they can't buy the equipment direct. That is for there safety and is as we know it the supply chain. When pricing is quoted directly to a HO then when a legitimate contractor becomes involved they have assumed what the system cost will be based off that info.

I like your idea of dealers/contractors would at least point them in the right direction without offending anyone and give them the understanding of the chain. Plus, it will give them a realistic cost of an actual system completely installed.

I have a issue when someone calls up and wants to know "How much is the boiler?" Like that is all we deal with is the heat source.

Dave_22

I agree- I thought soon would be before or at the start of this heating season.

Weezbo

*~/:)