Steam to forced air or minisplits?

JoeReg · April 2017

I have an 1998 Utica boiler 80% AFUE that nicely heats my 2000 sq foot 2 floor house in Northern NJ. It's a one pipe steam system. House was built in 1930.

I'm a first time home owner and am just getting to know my boiler. I appreciate the comfortable steam heat provided by the radiators in my house but I'm concerned about a few things:

1) pipes bang after cycle
2) a couple of the radiators hiss (haven't changed valves yet)
3) company that maintains boiler said two radiators over garage were not installed correctly. Pipe was too small and I will always have a problem getting heat to that part of the house. I also noticed some rusty water stains on the carpet so I'm assuming there was a leak at some point.
Note: I had asbestos removed from all the pipes when I moved in and plan to reinsulate if I keep the system
4) boiler is powered by oil and heating bill was very high (heating the house and cost me $500/month in dead of winter with the heat set at 55 F (my family hasn't moved in yet since we're doing other renovations)
5) Previous owner cooled house with window A/C units and I'm upgrading original 1930 windows to casement windows that can't use window A/C units. House has an attic fan but I need a solution for cooling as well.

I brought in a energy efficiency consultant who recommended an HVAC company and they said I would not get enough efficiency gains if I kept the steam and upgraded the boiler to gas (I need to have a gas line brought in since it is currently not hooked up). Instead, they recommended a high efficiency forced air system (96% AFUE variable stage) and a 16 SEER two stage condenser to handle air conditioning.

Currently there is no insulation in my house so I will be blowing cellulose in to exterior walls, insulating the attic, garage ceiling, and air sealing holes. This should bring my heating bill down significantly.

My contractor recommended trying ductless minisplits (wall hung units in the 4 rooms on the 1st floor and a ducted system with an air handler in the second floor closet (vents would be dropped in from the attic). This could be a nice solution since I would have lots of control over which rooms I heat/cool. I wouldn't have heat in the 1FL bathroom though and cost is higher than switching to forced air.

What should I do?

A) If I keep the steam, who should I contact to help me fix the existing problems? And is it worth switching the gas and swapping out the boiler? Do gas boilers for steam require venting out of the flue? If so, I would need to put a liner in my chimney--another expense! In this case, what do I do about cooling)?

Install ducts and switch to forced air powered by a new gas furnace (and condensor for A/C).

C) Go ductless. Here, I'm concerned about the cost of electricity, but the units are supposed to have a high coefficient of power. Not sure how to compare that to AFUE.

Seeking advice from the experts out there. I'm sure I missed some details, so please ask away.

KC_Jones · April 2017

First of all keep in mind energy consultants and or a typical HVAC company will almost always recommend tearing out steam because they know nothing about it. They also wrongly assume it isn't efficient because of high heating bills.

Why is it the steam that is costing all the money and not the lack of insulation? You are talking about massive upgrades to the house, but still want to point at steam as what is costing all the money. I would submit that for the amount of money you are talking about spending downgrading (yes it is a downgrade) to forced air you won't ever recover the costs with the efficiency gains....if you even gain anything.

In NJ there are several good guys @EzzT @Dave0176 would be able to take a look and give you an honest evaluation.

Most likely for a fraction of what you are talking about spending your steam system can be made to work correctly, by someone that actually knows what they are doing. I don't think you have had that person in your house, though they do like to talk like they do.

You should also consider the repair and construction costs of removing the steam and replacing with forced air. Patching holes, building and finishing any possible bulkheads to cover new duct work. I find people tend to ignore those things for comparison.

Just my $.02

Jamie Hall · April 2017

You will be far better off getting the steam system upgraded to where it should be -- just the one fact that you get a bang at times tells you that it's unhappy. A new gas boiler for the steam will be in the 84 to 86% efficiency range, if it is properly installed and set up, for the boiler -- and the various other losses which they don't talk about with forced air will make the two systems very close to the same efficiency.

You do need someone who isn't wedded to a particular solution (if the only thing you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail -- if the only thing you sell is forced air...). Either @EzzyT or @Dave0176 will do exactly what you want -- give you an honest evaluation of what is there, and an honest evaluation of what it will take to fix it and what your other options are.

Gas or oil? Kind of a toss up. All boilers, however -- and for that matter forced air furnaces -- require venting somewhere. Those guys can help you on that.

On the cooling. Minisplits have a lot to be said for them.

On the windows... oh well. You would have gotten a good deal more bang for your buck by keeping -- and adjusting as necessary -- the old ones and adding storms, such as the ones sold by this outfit: http://www.stormwindows.com/. But that's water over the dam.

JoeReg · April 2017

Thanks for your advice. I'll seek the advice of @EzzyT or @Dave0176. Maybe the most cost effective and comfortable solution would be to get the steam working as it should and look at a few minisplits for cooling.

ChrisJ · April 2017

I agree with others, call @EzzyT or @Dave0176 .

Many will tell you to get rid of the steam, don't do it.

I'm currently in the process of installing central air in my own 150+ year old house and my steam system is staying right where it is.

The forced air system will only be used for cooling. There's not much worse than forced air heat, especially in an old house.

Have a look at the pictures in my signature if you have time.

Ezzy or Dave will get your steam system running properly, and silently the way it should be and you won't regret it.

Henry · April 2017

I design and install hydronic and steam systems from residential to plants. But in my own home, I have a 96% full modulation of gas and ventilation furnace with a 3 ton 2 stage AC unit. I has a prefilter and electronic air filter. It is very quiet if you have the proper duct sizing. One cannot smell the dog and after a short time any cooking smells. The maintnance is only twice a year cleaning the prefilter and once a year washing the electronic filter. My 2,000 sq ft house has a gas firepace, stove, HWT and BBQ. It costs here in the Great White North $2600 CDN a year for gas. It is the cheapest heating and cooling system.

njtommy · April 2017

Keep the steam! You can't beat the comfort of a good steam system or hydronic heating system.

Installing mini splits is a good option for your house for adding AC and also having a heat source for the shoulder seasons. Especially if you want to just take the chill out of the house in the mornings.

JoeReg · April 2017

Thanks Chris. I'm planning to move in end of June so I'd like to take advantage of not being in the house now if we want to duct work. Seems like doing duct work for AC will be big expense, but I guess it will be cheaper if we decide to only install AC as opposed to AC + forced air. I saw you went with Amana. One of the contractors I interviewed recommended a 2 stage condensing unit. I'll ask for pricing for just the AC.

JoeReg · April 2017

@Henry that's what I've been told by the HVAC companies trying to sell me on the forced air system. They say the forced air systems have gotten a lot better over the years. You add on a humidifier and with the 96% variable speed furnace, it should be quiet and comfortable. Hard to know if I should just put the project (duct work) off until after we live in the house for a year or two before making changes. We could make it through a summer without AC.

Minisplits may be a good interim solution depending on cost. Thanks @njtommy for the suggestion. The trouble I have is putting the units in every room starts to get expensive.

ChrisJ · April 2017

The problem is it doesn't matter how good forced air heat gets, you're still heating with air which is a very poor way to transfer heat. The results are constant hot cold hot cold hot cold feeling. When the system is off, you'll feel cool or cold, when it's on you'll feel warm or hot. The better the insulation in your house, the less this is, but it'll never go away.

Steam and hot water systems using radiators or flooring (radiant) primarily heat using infrared. This transfers heat directly into objects rather than using air. Think of how the sun warms your face and objects outside and yet, there's no air involved.

A properly sized and installed forced air system isn't bad while the typical residential ones are horrible. But even the best won't compete with a properly working radiant or cast iron radiator system. I've got a feeling Henry's system is a few notches above the norm knowing him.

Yes, I went with an Amana 2 stage 16 SEER setup. Many make fun of Goodman/Amana but after doing a lot of research I found they're no worse than anyone else when it comes to the equipment.

You just need to make sure you hire a competent contractor to do the work. Same as anyone that works on steam, the brand of the boiler is moot, the guy installing it matters.

KC_Jones · April 2017

JoeReg said:
@Henry that's what I've been told by the HVAC companies trying to sell me on the forced air system. They say the forced air systems have gotten a lot better over the years. You add on a humidifier and with the 96% variable speed furnace, it should be quiet and comfortable. Hard to know if I should just put the project (duct work) off until after we live in the house for a year or two before making changes. We could make it through a summer without AC.

Minisplits may be a good interim solution depending on cost. Thanks @njtommy for the suggestion. The trouble I have is putting the units in every room starts to get expensive.

You should also find out how much one of those high end properly designed and installed forced air systems will cost you, then figure out if you will ever recover the install cost in energy savings....before it wears out and needs replacement.

I am sure someone will blast me for this comment, but to me ripping it out entirely and going forced air is like buying a new car because it gets a flat tire. It makes no logical sense to me.

njtommy · April 2017

@JoeReg Mini splits are no longer just ductless indoor units. They offer plenty ducted solutions big and small depending on house layouts. You will be able to use ducted in some areas of the house and ductless in others. Off the same out door unit. With this setup you get a lot of zoneing capabilities especially with having multiable floors.

If you end up going with a traditional forced air system for AC. I would still recommend a heat pump for shoulder seasons and emergency back up just incase your boiler has a problem.

njtommy · April 2017

Also I second the Amana stuff. Once you go to their 16seer units you get a great warranty. It's lifetime outdoor unit replacement if the compressor fails they install a new unit. Just not the compressor.

JUGHNE · April 2017

One of the first things you mentioned was "I appreciate the comfortable steam heat". Many people unknowably give up comfort by being convinced new forced air will be better. You may get used to your new discomfort with forced air, mainly because much money was spent and somehow one convinces themselves this has to be better.

I have radiant heated floors, walls and some baseboard. I never notice it running. I have a separate AC system with many supply grills and oversized return air system. I know when it runs, you hear it and feel the cool air moving.....not always comfortable but if it is 95 outside if will fill good.

Henry mentioned his system is quiet because he has proper sized ducting. A 1930 house is a real challenge to install proper sized ducting unless money is no object. Especially return air grills that usually use wall cavities so as to not look like an after thought. Second floor duct feeding from the basement is difficult. Usually put another furnace up there.

I would fix and keep the steam. Consider mini split AC/heat pumps.
The heat pumps would provide heat on mild cold days, (from 25 degrees on up it would be the most economical heat available) then the steam takes over. As you soak up the steam heat you will be reluctant to turn the heat pumps back on. IMO

EBEBRATT-Ed · April 2017

I prefer steam or water but the same way you can't compare a steam system that has problems to one that is done properly you also can't compare a sloppy forced air system to one that is sized correctly and properly installed.

While all buildings can be heated satisfactory with steam or water the same can't be said about forced air (especially masonry buildings with little insulation) Residences can be heated by either type of system.

Sailah · April 2017

I'm the last guy that would ever tell you to get rid of steam but at my house we have forced hot air, just the way it is. My house was built in 1815. We had (3) furnaces in the house.

This fall we replaced 2 monsters each their own zone with a single new zoned American Standard 96% platinum modulating furnace and new AC. The difference was astounding vs the old Williamson beasts we had. I can never tell it's running, hell I can't even feel the air moving. It just stays at exactly the same temp. Very comfortable.

We went from 230k BTUs in those furnaces to a single 65k. We also had the entire house insulated with 18" blown into attic and all the walls dense packed. It's about as tight as we can make an old house and the insulation money was well spent.

Now in your case I would rehab what you have vs ripping it out and putting in ducting. Run minsplits where you want the cooling. It'll cost you far more to do forced hot air.

Gsmith · April 2017

I live in northern New Jersey and have a mid-1920's house with no insulation in the walls, a little insulation (50 year old blown in cellulose) in the roof, 3 stories of about 700 s.f. each, a semi-heated basement, one-pipe steam system using a 30 year old gas boiler. I don't have the gas bills with me at work, but this past winter I did not have a monthly gas bill over $350 most were in the $200 -$225 range (winter months). I have gas water heating and cooking all in the same bill. I would not expect these days that oil would cost a lot more than gas on a btu basis, but of course that can change. I would keep the steam, convert to gas if the boiler is worn out or you can justify the economics. Can't comment on the A/C. If I can get to it tonight I'll send the monthly gas bills for the past 2 years, similar climate, probably similar size house, yours is better insulated, for comparison.

Henry · April 2017

Here is the best of both worlds that I designed for a friend. Geothermal was requested by him. I have 23 zones of radiant, a hydronic heat exchanger in the main duct, an indirect hot water tank and a 400K titanium pool heater. I have done similar in renovated old buildings.

JoeReg · April 2017

@Sailah, thanks for your comments. I have heard that the new forced air systems are much different than the old ones. For now, I'm looking into keeping the steam and oil boiler. I can always wait to upgrade the boiler when I switch to gas. Can't hurt to live in the house for a year with the existing system. I've asked for pricing for a minisplit install based on only where I would want cooling. I can start with one unit for downstairs (we're taking down a wall in the kitchen so one unit should be ok with the new open layout on the first floor) and a attic-ducted system for the second floor with an air handler in a second floor closet. Second floor will look very clean and we'll have the advantage of having the second floor on a separate zone.

JUGHNE · April 2017

Is the Mini Split you speak of to be cooling only? Often the best efficiency and choices are the AC/heat pumps. Even one heat pump will help with the heating cost.....again in mild heating weather.

JoeReg · April 2017

@JUGHNE I was looking at minisplits that do both heating and cooling. Thanks for the advice.

HVACNUT · April 2017

Short and sweet.
Keep the steam and have a qualified tech. make repairs and necessary adjustments.
Install a 2 zone, high efficiency heat pump system and 2 stage thermostats.

JoeReg · April 2017

I spoke to the HVAC company I'm working with about switching the oil boiler to gas and the cost would be significant and that still wouldn't address AC. I'm waiting on an updated quote for minisplits, but the cost of the units and install will probably be more than simply switching the entire system over to a new forced air system. I'm told if I go with a variable speed 96% efficiency furnace and 16 seer two stage condenser, it will actually be quite comfortable. HVAC contractor explained that the old FA from years ago is not the same as today's FA. A new FA system would give me two zones (I only have one), low cost energy (it's now high cost with oil and a boiler from 1998), and AC (I currently have none). Once the pricing comes in, I can make an informed decision.

So I'm looking for feedback on the following:

1) I want to know if a properly installed FA system can actually be comfortable. I know it won't be as good as steam, but given the cost to switch to gas and purchase a new boiler, it may make more sense for me to install the ducts and go with FA and AC in one package.

2) My energy load is only 38,000 BTU. Does it make sense to install a 65,000 BTU furnace or would that be considered over-sized? At what point would a unit be considered over-sized?

Jamie Hall · April 2017

1. Yes, it can be comfortable. It takes a very good installation and large ductwork with careful and thoughtful placement of the registers (particularly returns -- both return ducts and return registers often get skimped, to put it mildly) to avoid draughts and noise and to keep things even. But yes, it can be done. It usually isn't, but that's another story.
2. If your energy load is only 38K BTU -- double check that number -- a 65K furnace is almost twice as big as you need, and will cycle like crazy. You won't get anything like the efficiency numbers that are being quoted. To answer the last question -- in my book anything more than 10% over the design day load (or for steam, the connected radiation) is oversized.

ChrisJ · April 2017

Well,

I already told you my opinions on FA, including modern FA. When we go and stay at my parent's house which my dad built in 2007, I throw a blanket and pillows over the vent to keep the heat out of the bedroom.

Next, your steam system isn't necessarily only 1 zone.
I use two TRVs on my system which in a way, gives me 3 zones. It's not perfect, but it does work very well to keep my bedrooms nice and cool (64-66F vs rest of the house at 72F).

JoeReg · April 2017

Jamie Hall, would you recommend a 40K BTU unit or would that be cutting it too close? Since I'm insulating and sealing so much (attic, walls, garage) we will be reducing heat loss significantly. Also installing new triple pane Intus windows (probably overkill for my house), but they weren't much more than the double pane ones from Home Depot!

KC_Jones · April 2017

JoeReg said:

1) I want to know if a properly installed FA system can actually be comfortable. I know it won't be as good as steam, but given the cost to switch to gas and purchase a new boiler, it may make more sense for me to install the ducts and go with FA and AC in one package.

What is your definition of comfort? That is what you need to define for us so we can reference for you what you will get.

Put the following items in order of importance so we can advise you better.
Comfort
Price
Quality
Air conditioning

Jack · April 2017

Even in an extensive re-model it is very difficult to install an excellent duct system, and excellent is the least you want in ducting. HVAC contractors will sell the benefits of the equipment, but my experience says that between that excellent technology and your comfort lies a less than excellent duct system. Also, look at the room the duct system will take up. It is significant. Mini-splits on the other hand are pretty easy to install in an extensive re-model and will offer excellent comfort and efficiency. Keep your oil steam system for the time being making necessary system repairs. The gas conversion is a different issue. If you want a gas range, fireplace, dryer, tankless water heater and your steam guy says your current boiler is on its last legs, then that decision will have to be made.
You will find that the mini-splits will do an excellent and cost effective job cooling, dehumidifying and heating in the shoulder seasons and when it gets cold (and you get to decide this point, or more correctly your wife and kids) you turn on the steam. You then have two heating systems backing each other up. If for any reason the steam goes down, the mini-splits can pick up the load...if you select the right units. If you go with mini-splits be very careful to understand clearly the temp. operating limits and efficiency of each model. They vary widely even within every manuf offerings. I went with the highest efficiency cooling and heating units available in the main first floor area that is always conditioned and with a separate multi head unit in the bedrooms. The multi is a bit less efficient but still does and excellent job, and the whole house is zoned.

Jamie Hall · April 2017

You ask if I would suggest the 40K unit.

If it were mine to do, I wouldn't touch forced air with a barge pole, but I'm trying to be reasonably fair to the preferences of the customer -- that's you, @JoeReg . As others have suggested, I would keep the steam without one second's hesitation, and upgrade the boiler to gas when and if I needed to. If I truly needed the A/C, I'd go with minisplits, and only put them where I needed them.

I have seen a few forced air installations I would be comfortable with, personally -- in museums which have adequate mechanical spaces for the ducting. But my criteria for "comfortable" are stiffer than most -- I want silence, even heat, and no draughts. In a residence, that translates to steam or hot water heat.

Also I would be very careful with your calculations on heat loss; I believe I recommended that you double check those calculations. I am concerned that you may not have allowed enough for infiltration or, if you are really successful with sealing the place up, for heating the minimum required fresh air exchange (you need at least two full air changes per hour and four is better, to keep indoor air quality at some reasonable level). That air change can be done through heat exchangers on the duct work, but that puts an extra load on the ductwork. You may also be somewhat optimistic as to the actual efficiency of the insulation; it is very difficult, in a remodel, to really get the insulation (never mind the vapour and infiltration barriers) as thorough as you would like -- unless you are doing a full scale, walls torn out gut job.

As @Jack said above, the difficulty is going to be in designing and installing the needed ductwork.

Keep in mind two things: you can get almost anything you want, if you are willing to pay for it. And you will get exactly what you pay for, and no miracles.

KC_Jones · April 2017

JoeReg said:
I spoke to the HVAC company I'm working with about switching the oil boiler to gas and the cost would be significant and that still wouldn't address AC. I'm waiting on an updated quote for minisplits, but the cost of the units and install will probably be more than simply switching the entire system over to a new forced air system. I'm told if I go with a variable speed 96% efficiency furnace and 16 seer two stage condenser, it will actually be quite comfortable. HVAC contractor explained that the old FA from years ago is not the same as today's FA. A new FA system would give me two zones (I only have one), low cost energy (it's now high cost with oil and a boiler from 1998), and AC (I currently have none). Once the pricing comes in, I can make an informed decision.

I will reiterate to you, it's not about the equipment it's about proper duct design and installation. This comment from a contractor would honestly scare me just a bit. How much time did they spend selling you on the benefits of new equipment versus explaining to you on the importance of good duct design and installation?

As @Jamie Hall said good duct work can be very intrusive into the house. Everywhere a duct goes you lose that space. Have you priced out all the required repairs to the house for such a conversion? Possibly building bulkheads around duct lines? Patching all the floors where the steam pipes are removed? There are a lot of associated costs with a project like this and most times I find people do not factor them in up front....and regret it later.

Have you called one of the steam guys we recommended for a good evaluation of what you have?

ChrisJ · April 2017

Let's be honest.

Forced hot air. You pull air in through a return duct, pass it through a heat exchanger and then distribute it through the home via supply ducts.

That's how it worked in the 1950s, and it's how it works today. It's a bunch of pipes and a blower. That's it.

The forced air today, is exactly what the old forced air was.
The difference is much larger ducts moving cooler air so it's less noticeable but it requires much larger ducts to work right.

But there's no magic being done by the new equipment aside from a modern furnace only lasting a fraction of what a 1950s one did. If you install a modern furnace with undersized ductwork in a drafty house the results are going to be terrible, just as they always have.

JoeReg · April 2017

Jamie Hall said:
You ask if I would suggest the 40K unit.

Also I would be very careful with your calculations on heat loss; I believe I recommended that you double check those calculations. I am concerned that you may not have allowed enough for infiltration or, if you are really successful with sealing the place up, for heating the minimum required fresh air exchange (you need at least two full air changes per hour and four is better, to keep indoor air quality at some reasonable level). That air change can be done through heat exchangers on the duct work, but that puts an extra load on the ductwork. You may also be somewhat optimistic as to the actual efficiency of the insulation; it is very difficult, in a remodel, to really get the insulation (never mind the vapour and infiltration barriers) as thorough as you would like -- unless you are doing a full scale, walls torn out gut job.

As @Jack said above, the difficulty is going to be in designing and installing the needed ductwork.

Keep in mind two things: you can get almost anything you want, if you are willing to pay for it. And you will get exactly what you pay for, and no miracles.

For duct work, it will be pretty straightforward. first floor fed from basement and second floor fed from attic. a line from the furnace would go straight through the back of the dining room and middle bedroom. Only repairs (as far as I'm told) would be boxing out the ducts in the dining room and middle bedroom and patching the wood floors where the radiator pipes have been removed (I think I can do that part myself).

As for insulation, I did a blower door test and found that the house was 3x as leaky as it should be. With insulation, we're supposed to get to normal modern building standards, but it won't be so tight that I need to install an ERV.

Thanks for the caution about forced air. I'm carefully weighing the pros and cons. Maybe I can just wait a year and see how things go with oil heat?

@KC_Jones yes I contacted both guys that were recommended. I haven't decided if I will do the evaluation yet. Waiting to see how much the minisplits will cost to install.

JUGHNE · April 2017

It is easy to feed supply duct to rooms from the basement, small floor diffuser maybe 4 X 10 or so. The real challenge is return the air from each room to the furnace. Return requires about 1.5 times the ducting of supply. Quick and easy is large floor grills which will collect all sorts of junk in them, dirt, dust, pet hair, spilled milk and toys. And you will always hear them.
Would your new forced air furnace be gas or oil?

ChrisJ · April 2017

Don't worry.
The floor supplies will collect all sorts of junk and even water as well especially near doors.

KC_Jones · April 2017

I'm not trying to sway you either way (even though I am a steam fan), but I think you are still missing some details.

As far as repairs, what kind of flooring do you have? Do you know if you can still buy it to do the repairs? If you can how much does it cost? I know in my house flooring repairs (heart yellow pine) can break the bank alone. What does the trim in the house look like? Can you still buy it to trim out all the new walls/boxes you build around the ducts? If you can't and have to custom mill it that is $$. If you decide to replace it all to match again that is $$.

For the record duct work is never "straight forward" if it's done properly. Get the steam guys in there, you are taking advice from people that don't know what they are talking about. Me I prefer to make informed decisions.

Most of us only post this information to people because this website is filled with people coming here after getting screwed asking how to fix it, the answer many times is rip it out and start over or you should have kept the steam (or hot water as the case may be).

Steamhead · April 2017

@JoeReg , it's very simple. Keep the steam. You will NEVER be as comfortable with forced-air as you will with steam, no matter what the furnasty guys say to try to sell their tin. That's just the way it is.

Not sure what model Utica boiler you have, but if it's in good shape, you should be able to switch it to gas by having a Carlin EZ-Gas burner installed. This would cost less than a completely new boiler. Then, when it's time to replace the Utica, you simply get a similar type of boiler and install the existing EZ-Gas onto it. Good way of spreading out the cost, and the operating efficiency of this setup is up to 6% better. Here's one of our recent ones, this is a Slant/Fin:

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/161736/flir-video-of-slant-fin-intrepid-boiler-fired-with-carlin-ez-gas-burner

How about some pics of your boiler?

JoeReg · April 2017

Here's the Utica Starfire Boiler manufactured in 1998 (I think the model number is BV02880) before and water heater. Was told by company that maintains it that it can't be converted to gas.

JoeReg · April 2017

KC_Jones said:

As far as repairs, what kind of flooring do you have? Do you know if you can still buy it to do the repairs? If you can how much does it cost? I know in my house flooring repairs (heart yellow pine) can break the bank alone. What does the trim in the house look like? Can you still buy it to trim out all the new walls/boxes you build around the ducts? If you can't and have to custom mill it that is $$. If you decide to replace it all to match again that is $$.

Floors are oak so I should be able to patch them pretty easily. I have some available that I could use. Not sure how much it would cost. I need to look into the trim. Thanks for raising this.

JoeReg · April 2017

JUGHNE said:

Would your new forced air furnace be gas or oil?

Gas. I would have to bring a line into the house.

ChrisJ · April 2017

Here's an idea that may make this whole thing a lot more simple.

Call @Dave0176 or message him.
DL Mechanical LLC Heating & Cooling 732-266-5386
Specializing in Steam Heating, Serving most of NJ

He does both forced air and steam and he does them very well and charges fair and honest prices.

Here's a thread showing some of his recent work.
https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/161822/complete-ripout#latest

KC_Jones · April 2017

JoeReg said:

Here's the Utica Starfire Boiler manufactured in 1998 (I think the model number is BV02880) before and water heater. Was told by company that maintains it that it can't be converted to gas.

And again with the copper piping. Did they tell you anything about the improper piping or are they just trying to sell you a forced air system?

Can't be converted to gas? Hmmm I think there are some contractors that know what's going on that would disagree with that.

https://forum.heatinghelp.com/discussion/142138/utica-starfire-3-steam-boiler-oil-burner-conversion-to-gas-burner
@Steamhead

@ChrisJ is correct call @Dave0176.

Steam to forced air or minisplits?

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