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Navien Combi Boilers



  • HDEHDE Member Posts: 220
    edited April 2011
    Ah yes the Challenger

    Im a big fan of the Prestige, I think my dad has serial # 00000000019.

    Their Excellence is also a fine product, except the weight, price and depletion of indirect tank quickly such as tub filling results in a less than 3 gpm uncontrolled tankless unit in a ways.

    I've also had the opportunity of visiting the ACV HQ in Brussels. And yes they do not manufacture the Challenger. The product remains to be truly tested however, its pitfalls of course is the aluminum heat exchanger (we all know their issues) and I'm uncertain how the copper domestic coils will work sandwiched inside the aluminum. Will there be issues with dissimilar metals, abrasion due to two metals with different properties and temps?

    Lastly the low BTU's results in a combi that has limited place (small home/condo/apt).

    I first saw the TT Challenger at the 2010 AHR show in Miami. If I remember my European boilers it is a Brötje Ecotherm which is a member of the BAXI Group, thats why the burner and heat exchanger should look familiar.

    You sell Navien? what other tankless do you have? Do you have the Navien Combi also?

    On a side note did you know the AO Smith Next Hybrid and the Voltex Ht Pmp water heaters are made/from China?
  • ChrisChris Member Posts: 3,056
    edited April 2011

    For the input. I too feel that the Challenger has a very limited market application. I tend to think it's there avenue to apartment complexs, town houses and similar bath and a half applications. It looks more like a kick space heater on steriods in some aspects.

    The HX and copper domestic coils don't sit well with me. The types of applications this unit targets generally sees the least service and that shouts potential problems in my eyes. Water quality in these parts is not the greatest. I also just found out that Triangle found a new vendor to make their HX's. My understanding is that the previous vendor was unable to make them a larger HX above 399 and they were finding more quality control issues with them as they increased demand on them. They are also making little changes such as going 439SS through the entire HX and beefing up the passgeways. It never sits well with me when I here changes in HX's but making something better is never a bad thing.

    The reason I asked about the Challenger is I'm meeting with the local rep next week. They are dangling the Challenger as a not everyone is going to be able to get and we want you to have it. I've been in the Wholesale side for a long time and you know as well as I that that's like a politician promising the world until he's elected..

    Yeah we are the typical Vegas Strip worker. Nortiz, Navien and a slew of mod/cons to include Triangle. We are the only guys on the block though that actually stock and highlight Viessmann. I started selling it back in the early early 90's when I worked in New England. Grew up in the early days of Stadler (my first radiant line), Viessmann under the Joe Freidrich atmosphere. Constant circulation and NR-32's baby. I actually have the privilage to have all his articles in chronological order that he wrote during his days with Contractor Mag. I have to thank Mr Ross for those as he and Joe are still close. Its amazing at times to read his thoughts then and see it in what we are doing now.. .

    You mean the up and coming top mfg dog on the planet. Doesn't surprise me.
    "The bitter taste of a poor installation remains much longer than the sweet taste of the lowest price."
  • HDEHDE Member Posts: 220
    Ht Exchangers

    To fill in a few blanks, TT for whatever reason started shopping for a new manufacturer of the their heat exchanger. Once they found one and switched, the prior one sitting in Poland had no work or orders and pitched it to others.

    Thats now why Lochinvar has switched from Gianonni to Fire tube ("TT design"), along with NY Thrmal (NTI).
  • ChrisChris Member Posts: 3,056
    I See Says The Blind Man

    Makes sense. It is a nice design. Wouldn't surprise me to soon see the US four jump on that wagon train.
    "The bitter taste of a poor installation remains much longer than the sweet taste of the lowest price."
  • HomeOwner1HomeOwner1 Member Posts: 134
    You are incorrect.

    IT IS A BOILER. Please check your facts. It is very frustrating when researching as a homeowner looking through bad information in your posts.
  • TonySTonyS Member Posts: 849
    I have only installed one

    and it has been working very well. But be aware if you are going to use water hotter than 140 you must vent with schedule 80 cpvc or PP.
  • JohnHenryJohnHenry Member Posts: 70
    my CH-210

    Continues to work very well after 2 heating seasons. Not a single issue not involving the biological interface :)

    I figure over those two heating seasons I've saved 3-4 times the cost of the "combination heating unit" itself in fuel cost and efficiency (changed from oil to gas). Not a bad ROI...
    The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
  • TonySTonyS Member Posts: 849
    They purchase exchangers from both manufacturers

    now. A couple of years ago they could not keep up with demand and had to find another manufacturer. That is why there are two now. That type of robotic welding isnt performed by everyone. Setting up the machinery is an art in itself unlike the bend and stamp crowd it takes hi tech equipment to make that fire tube exchanger. 
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